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Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Since my original thread got a bit long winded I decided to start a new, less cluttered one.


Original for reference
http://pub37.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=3155626639&frmid=16&msgid=1437656&cmd=show


Continuing to investigate what is needed for this bike I took it out of the garage and into the light. First real look over since filling my mind with the knowledge I have learned here and elsewhere.

Figured out the reason that the bike felt so wobbly . Wiggling the back end around ( I had noticed how bad it was when I unloaded it the first time and thought it was just all of the loose bolts) a second set of eyes pointed out how loose the head stock bearing are. Then we looked closer at the front forks and there are some sloppy repairs or something. (see photos) The forks are gonna have to come apart. Cleaned up and I presume replace things like the friction disc ect. I guess I should have the sloppy welds ground off to see how the repairs were done. Do the have plugs in the tubes? That sort of thing... Then hopefully a nicer weld job and put it back together properly.

Please let me know if you have any suggestions on how to deal with this . Suggestions on where to get the "wear and tear" parts. And warnings if you think of other problems to look for.

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email (option): wadeschields@mindspring.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Ignore the spam post above I'll ask Henk to remove it.

Your forks definitely need a proper sorting out. The weld repairs need to be re-done and possibly with an internal spigot repair somehow. The center mudguard support weld blob, could possibly be an attempt to make up the 1/2" difference if you have the longer forks, which you probably have. Measure from the center of the damper spindle to the center of the wheel spindle.

That not to mention inspection and probable refurbishment of the fork links and bushes. Ron

T5Tim1
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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

I agree with Ron.

The weld as shown in the second black and white photo seems to have been a bit thick, and so the side plates are not able to be fully tightened up to the fork itself. Then the main stem does not seem to be tightened up to the headstock - and that will have the bike wandering all over the road. It is possible to put washers under the side plates, although I don't recommend it as anything other than a bodge. The weld needs to be redone.

Best wishes,

Allan

email (option): allanmatchless@yahoo.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

I have a crack in the lower rear frame tube. It to was poorly done.
I saw a very neat idea. You cut a piece if replacement tube. Then the drilled a slot into both ends. Then a smaller diameter tube is inserted into both ends. Then a stub was welded to the inserted tube so when placed into position the stub can be used to place the tube into the other end of the original tube. Weld everything up and grind off the stubs.
I wished I could draw a picture. They say a picture is worth a thousand words.

email (option): cbhaws@verizon.net

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Thanks Everyone . Great info and ideas. Definitely plan to make the forks right. It is the only suspension after all and a saftey concern . So - Long forks? Was that an option in 43 or do you think these forks are not original to the bike? If not, any reason to search for the correct ones rather then fix these??? Just asking . I don't plan at this time to do a nut and bolt restoration but I always say that just before a do a nut and bolt restoration .. lol

email (option): wadeschields@mindspring.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

The short forks are typical for the Deluxe model M20 fitted with a brake rod. At some point later in 1940, the fork length was increased by 1/2" to give some extra ground clearance I guess. BSA's idea to make up the difference at the center mudguard support was a crude 1/2" long hex spacer. Which you can see in the picture I posted above. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Another fork question. Did the 1943 forks have the Steering Dampener or not? And What is the difference between the forks the have a knob on both sides of the forks and the ones that dont?
Which one is wright for 43? Knob on both sides or just on one side?

email (option): wadeschields@mindspring.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

The steering damper was deleted by 1943.
M20's only ever had one fork damper knob (on the right side) Some of the earlier bikes had no hand wheel and had to be adjusted with a spanner. In fact apart from Royal Enfield models which had a hand wheel both sides (left and right hand threads) I can't think of any other British WD bike that had two. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Dampers on both sides were fitted to some pre WWII bikes
Would have to spend too many hours looking up parts books to give a definative answer
The M23 Empire Stars & I think M24 Gold Stars had double dampers and the deluxe versions of everything else .
Std versions only got the one
Left & right are the same just flipped over
Pre war ones are usually steel and mostly chrome plated ( deluxe bikes had more chrome ) .

email (option): bsansw1@tpg.com.au

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Interesting Trevor! However I don't think Pre War civilian bikes have any relevance to the enquiry? Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

I decided to make a deal for these forks. They seem to fit the bill.... by the photos and descriptions of what should be on my 43.

As long as they are nice when they are delivered I will be happy with the deal I was able to make for them..
Then I would say the build can begin...

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email (option): wadeschields@mindspring.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

I disappeared for a bit there but I am back (I hope) been crazy busy with work and life so time has been short.... I managed to find a free shed on facebook marketplace ... I little rough but I had it moved to my place for a good price and then fixed and replaced the bad parts , painted , insulated , put in a window for light and an AC unit . Hung LED lighting , a stereo and covered the walls with spare drywall and moved the WM20 in to my dedicated , one bike at a time, workshop.... Now the fun can begin.

Strip it down and put it back together again will be the plan

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Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Wow! very good. indeed, let the fun start! succes.:+1:

email (option): info@wetblast.nl

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Great shed...Somewhere 'proper' to work vastly increases the chances of success I'd say...Music is an essential as well IMO...In my case the duller the job (rubbing down components), the louder the music...:laughing: ....

That looks like a nice set of replacement forks you've bought and I'm sure they will work out to be the best course of action...Keep us posted on progress!...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Re: Continuation of my 1943 WM20 saga

Do not take any chances with those forks
Too many times I have been at an event where the fork tubes fractured with very un-prety results for both rider & mount.
So have then grit blasted and crack tested at a minimum, X-rays are even better.
Particular close attention to the joints between the forgings & the tubes.
Bad enough for an old fart like me but a disaster if you end up being unable to work for months.
As you are probably going to have them painted in kakahi of some kind to match the bike then the only extra cost is the actual testing.
The tubes were furnace braized into the fittings so you should see a nice ring of yellow around the steel
If it is broken or shows any signs of corrosion then it is off to the frame man .

Get local friction discs and avoid NOS or ebay / amazon as there is a lot of stuff out there that has well & truely passed it's use by date and can crumble in use .
Having ridden 450 Km back from a rally with no damping it makes bull riding look smooth & easy.
From memory I used A 65 discs for the steering and ended up getting some custom cut of the forks .

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