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EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Now when I'm done with the site update I dare to ask if there are any volunteers for the EOY spreadsheets? I have created a sheet for albums with columns for the critics' lists that have been posted in the forum. However, I have not filled in the albums and their positions.

It would be greatly appreciated if someone would like to take responsibility for this document. It's a quite busy task, especially around Christmas and New Years Eve, but perhaps someone could take care of it during December and then someone else in January?

albums2010.xls

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I would love to help but I really can't. Too busy (work, family, looking for a beter job). I can't even play the forum games anymore (except the decade polls, of course)
But I'm sure somebody can take it here.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Of course, the one who fill in the early lists doesn't have to continue through December. Any contributions are much appreciated.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Its new to see THESE NEW PURITANS taking some high positions on these early lists. Same with John Grant.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I don't think I would at all mind this task if it hasn't been claimed yet.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

That's great, Shaun! Do you know how to fill it in?

Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I may work from 12 December. I will contact Shaun through this thread

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Is there something more to it than simply filling in the appropriate blanks from the data provided in the EOY lists board?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I may not need to say these things to you Shaun, but for the addition of new lists, some explanations might be needed. I think all information you need is in cells GA1-GA4, but let me know if you have any questions. Also, always open the spreadsheet in activate macro mode so that you don't lose the macro functions and enter the artist/band names consistently (i.e. don't mix "Band", "The Band" and "Band, The") so there won't be any duplicates.

Will you upload the spreadsheet to the web on your own or will you sent it to me by email?

PS. The information in cell GA1 "Enter critics' lists in columns L-DP." should of course be "Enter critics' lists in columns R-FZ."

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I will take the songs spreadsheet. I have NME and Grammy so far. Please post more songs lists as you find them.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Thanks Chris!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Henrik, could you keep a running tally of which lists are AM-eligible so that I don't include data for the wrong ones? Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Shaun
Henrik, could you keep a running tally of which lists are AM-eligible so that I don't include data for the wrong ones? Thanks!
Of course. I will do it in the critics' lists section.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I hate to be the first to nag, but what's the time frame on getting the spreadsheet published on the site?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Doug
I hate to be the first to nag, but what's the time frame on getting the spreadsheet published on the site?
Shaun, I know it's A LOT of lists you have to add, so maybe it's better to post a first version soon, even if the spreadsheet is not "up to date".

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Henrik, I sent you a spreadsheet last week. Did you receive it?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Chris
Henrik, I sent you a spreadsheet last week. Did you receive it?
I totally missed that one! Will upload soon. Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Henrik
Chris
Henrik, I sent you a spreadsheet last week. Did you receive it?
I totally missed that one! Will upload soon. Thanks!


I'm sometimes really bad at finding things, so therefore I need to ask: Has this spreadsheet been uploaded and if so where can it be found?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Shaun is still working on it.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Shaun, how are thing going with the EOY album lists? I think it would be good to have a first version of the spreadsheet posted on the site very soon.

Please let me know when you have read this message. Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

For people who cannot wait :

http://features.metacritic.com/features/2010/music-critic-top-ten-lists-best-of-2010/

Metacritic 1 - Shaun 0

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Tom
For people who cannot wait :

http://features.metacritic.com/features/2010/music-critic-top-ten-lists-best-of-2010/

Metacritic 1 - Shaun 0



wow...no love for Fly Lo and little love for Gorillaz based on those rankings...thanks Tom for the link!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I don't want to step on Shaun's toes, but I have a rough version of the album spreadsheet I've put together in my free time (I'm a teacher, and I've had plenty of free time since the semester ended last week).

I can put it up if people want an early fix, though I can't promise to continue to update it because I'll be traveling for the holidays.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Pls do!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Can do. How do I upload the spreadsheet to the board here? It's too big to convert to Google docs.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Apologies for any confusion regarding the 2010 EOY albums spreadsheet. I've been out of town this past week and had not been asked to provide running updates of early incarnations of the spreadsheet, thinking instead that I would only be submitting a final version. Anyway, I have already compiled those 15 or so album lists that were released before my departure, and can have those published in the interim included in maybe two days' time.

That is, unless I'm hearing that somebody else has already made my efforts redundant. I volunteered my time to assist in the tedious compilation of lists that Henrik wished not to have fall upon himself, and I was never told that live updates would be desired, let alone expected. While I would be somewhat annoyed to discover that the work I've completed thus far has been reproduced by others who felt I wasn't adequately performing the task I volunteered for, that would be preferable to putting further hours into a task that has already been replicated, so please let me know quickly if this is the case. Thanks.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Go ahead and put yours up, Shaun. As I said, I didn't mean to step on any toes. I started working on a spreadsheet out of my own personal curiosity and boredom, but I won't be able to keep up with it, and it is far from comprehensive right now anyway. My apologies.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Shaun
Apologies for any confusion regarding the 2010 EOY albums spreadsheet. I've been out of town this past week and had not been asked to provide running updates of early incarnations of the spreadsheet, thinking instead that I would only be submitting a final version. Anyway, I have already compiled those 15 or so album lists that were released before my departure, and can have those published in the interim included in maybe two days' time.

That is, unless I'm hearing that somebody else has already made my efforts redundant. I volunteered my time to assist in the tedious compilation of lists that Henrik wished not to have fall upon himself, and I was never told that live updates would be desired, let alone expected. While I would be somewhat annoyed to discover that the work I've completed thus far has been reproduced by others who felt I wasn't adequately performing the task I volunteered for, that would be preferable to putting further hours into a task that has already been replicated, so please let me know quickly if this is the case. Thanks.
That's great news, Shaun! I look forward to the update!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Kingoftonga
Go ahead and put yours up, Shaun. As I said, I didn't mean to step on any toes. I started working on a spreadsheet out of my own personal curiosity and boredom, but I won't be able to keep up with it, and it is far from comprehensive right now anyway. My apologies.


No problem at all, you can of course feel free to put in whatever work you'd like. I was just hoping I hadn't inadvertently failed to live up to my calling here.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Look forward to seeing your work Shaun.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

The moment you post that thing I'm going to do a factor analysis.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Hope it's coming soon.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Well, I returned home on Sunday to discover I had no internet and wasn't visited by a technician until this afternoon, so I wasn't able to update with the new lists yet. But, rather than keep you waiting longer while I do so, here's a link to the document from before my vacation: http://www.mediafire.com/?gu6txthoa710ytk

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Can someone provide a link to an Excel version of this? I don't even know what an .ods file is. Thanks in advance!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler
Can someone provide a link to an Excel version of this? I don't even know what an .ods file is. Thanks in advance!


It opens in Excel, but there seems to be an issue with the scores for all of the albums, so many lists are present but there is no order to them.

Regardless, it's nice to see it coming together! Thanks, Shaun!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Moonbeam
Harold Wexler
Can someone provide a link to an Excel version of this? I don't even know what an .ods file is. Thanks in advance!


It opens in Excel, but there seems to be an issue with the scores for all of the albums, so many lists are present but there is no order to them.


I'm apparently doing something wrong, then. I'm assuming there will be a link on the homepage at some point, so I'll wait for that. Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler
Moonbeam
Harold Wexler
Can someone provide a link to an Excel version of this? I don't even know what an .ods file is. Thanks in advance!


It opens in Excel, but there seems to be an issue with the scores for all of the albums, so many lists are present but there is no order to them.


I'm apparently doing something wrong, then. I'm assuming there will be a link on the homepage at some point, so I'll wait for that. Thanks!


When I went to the link, it gave me the option to open or save the file, and it allowed me to open it in Excel! Still, I imagine a revised version with the formulas working will be up soon.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Moonbeam
When I went to the link, it gave me the option to open or save the file, and it allowed me to open it in Excel! Still, I imagine a revised version with the formulas working will be up soon.


Sorry, it's just not doing it for me. I really don't want to have to download software just to open one file, which I think I would need to do here, so as I said I'll just wait for a file I can actually open. I guess I just wasn't made for these times...

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I can not open the spreadsheet.

Anyone can publish the list in this thread? At least the top 50 albums?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

"Sorry, it's just not doing it for me. I really don't want to have to download software just to open one file, which I think I would need to do here, so as I said I'll just wait for a file I can actually open. I guess I just wasn't made for these times..."

Actually the download button just opens the file...Don't worry Harold you won't be subscribing to any software by doing this...Anyway it worked perfectly for me guys!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

o.m.
Actually the download button just opens the file...Don't worry Harold you won't be subscribing to any software by doing this...Anyway it worked perfectly for me guys!


That's great. Then could you please post the list on the forum, or convert it to Excel and create a link? Because on my computer, the file won't open no matter what I do.

I hate to be a pest about this. I just want to see the list.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Seems like the conversion from the OpenDocument Spreadsheet (ODS) to Excel makes it do weird things with divisions by zero. I copy/pasted the formulas from the original sheet into the ODS file and saved it as an Excel file. Should work.

Edit: Yep, works.

Great to see The National doing so fantastically.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Stephan
Edit: Yep, works.


Thank you, Stephan! This is great. It's shaping up nicely. Excellent work, Shaun!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Thanks, Stephan!

I'm disappointed that Arcade Fire has run away with album of the year honors already. The only #1 spot I think it deserves is in a list of the most disappointing albums of the year.

I hope Janelle Monáe can sneak into the top 5 and that LCD Soundsystem manages to stay there!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I liked it. I don't see what makes their debut so much better but than again I say the same thing about Liz Phair and her third album. Someone had the nerve to call the guy from Deerhunter OLD when he's not even 29 til I think May of next year. Look at the top 4 best reviewed albums so far. All by guys in their mid 30s. I think 1999 is ranked so low for the same reason. Mostly 30 somethings and older in the top 25.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Arcade Fire landing #1 with Kanye only at #4 is Shameful. Dark Fantasy is imo, the best album of the last several years. The Suburbs is good, but no masterpiece.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Jonathon
Arcade Fire landing #1 with Kanye only at #4 is Shameful. Dark Fantasy is imo, the best album of the last several years. The Suburbs is good, but no masterpiece.


I haven't heard Kanye bar a few songs, but it surely seems more worthy than The Suburbs. Then again, I think The Age of Adz is the best album I've heard in years, and The ArchAndroid would be had Sufjan not stolen that claim!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Jonathon
Arcade Fire landing #1 with Kanye only at #4 is Shameful. Dark Fantasy is imo, the best album of the last several years. The Suburbs is good, but no masterpiece.


As always, the main problem is that you've got a huge majority of indie-oriented lists, so kanye or non-indie performers don't stand a chance.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

For me, it's the worst year of music since.....a very long time.
I don't find any album who could be really better than any other.
Zero excellent and instantaneous classic.
Few good albums.
And a lot of average.

And especially, no fabulous song this year, when they could be count by handful last years. Except maybe the Bryan Ferry song : Heartache By Numbers.

A very disapointed year.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think you all need to remember that that spreadsheet is in initial list. The number of publications giving out their EOYs has doubled since then.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think Kanye any higher than #10 and Janelle Monae any lower than #1 is shameful. Kanye's album seems to get 75% of it's praise just from talking about his own icon status, and only 25% where he actually deserves it, which is his incredible mixing skill.

Might be a few days before I can deliver the promised statistical analysis. I just moved and won't get on the wireless until the only roommate who knows the password gets back from India.

(So, I probably won't be able to vote in this week's Unacclaimed either.)

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

too many familiar bands who have already made the top 5 or 10 in the past. A lot of these artists have put out better records which makes this year seem inferior to the years they all released their big classic records. There are some good new bands and break out bands but they all seem to be pushed aside in favor of bands we're already used to seeing dominating the EOYs. That's what makes this year not look so good. We've heard this before about the Arcade Fire. Remember Neon Bible? That fell from #1 to #8 so I doubt they'll be able to hold on to even the top 3 even though I feel both their follow ups are as good to their decent but overrated debut.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Otisredding
I can not open the spreadsheet.

Anyone can publish the list in this thread? At least the top 50 albums?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I disagree about this being a weak year; I think this has been the best year in music since 2007.

Kanye's album is an instant classic and a possible game changer.

Janelle beats the piss out of most other "Debut of the year" albums from the past ten years.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

It still makes me laugh how so many posters on this site state their own personal tastes and ideas on what is "the best" music as if they are carved-in-stone facts.

To critisize any list, or culmination of lists, is silly. It's called "difference of opinion" and in any subjective field, such as music, it's bound to happen.

If your favorite album or albums aren't doing as well as you think they should on these year-end lists, then maybe it's time just to admit you're in a minority with your adoration.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

For those that can't open:

1. Arcade Fire The Suburbs
2. LCD Soundsystem This Is Happening
3. The National High Violet
4. Kanye West My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
5. Beach House Teen Dream
6. Janelle Monae The ArchAndroid
7. The Black Keys Brothers
8. Big Boi Sir Lucious Left Foot
9. Caribou Swim
10. Deerhunter Halcyon Digest
11. Vampire Weekend Contra
12. Yeasayer Odd Blood
13. Robyn Body Talk
14. These New Puritans Hidden
15. Ariel Pink's Haunted Graffiti Before Today
16. Gorillaz Plastic Beach
17. Joanna Newsom Have One On Me
18. Foals Total Life Forever
19. Gil Scott-Heron I'm New Here
20. Sleigh Bells Treats
21. Flying Lotus Cosmogramma
22. Best Coast Crazy For You
23. Robert Plant Band Of Joy
24. MGMT Congratulations
25. Titus Andronicus The Monitor
26. Sufjan Stevens The Age Of Adz
27. Grinderman Grinderman 2
28. Laura Marling I Speak Because I Can
29. Drake Thank Me Later
30. John Grant Queen Of Denmark
31. Four Tet There Is Love In You
32. Neil Young Le Noise
33. Jamey Johnson The Guitar Song
34. Salem King Night
35. Crystal Castles Crystal Castles
36. Emeralds Does It Look Like I'm Here?
37. Mavis Staples You Are Not Alone
38. Phosphorescent Here's To Taking It Easy
39. The Roots How I Got Over
40. Paul Weller Wake Up The Nation
41. The Walkmen Lisbon
42. Avi Buffalo Avi Buffalo
43. Pantha Du Prince Black Noise
44. Warpaint The Fool
45. Midlake The Courage Of Others
46. Mumford & Sons Sigh No More
47. Band Of Horses Infinite Arms
48. Surfer Blood Astro Coast
49. Spoon Transference
50. Edwyn Collins Losing Sleep
51. Everything Everything Man Alive
52. M.I.A. Maya
53. Liars Sisterworld
54. Sharon Jones & The Dap-Kings I Learned The Hard Way
55. The Drums The Drums
56. Manic Street Preachers Postcards From A Young Man
57. Matthew Dear Black City
58. Hot Chip One Life Stand
59. Darkstar North
60. Field Music Field Music (Measure)
61. Tame Impala Innerspeaker
62. Villagers Becoming A Jackal
63. Aloe Blacc Good Things
64. The Tallest Man On Earth The Wild Hunt
65. Frightened Rabbit The Winter Of Mixed Drinks
66. Jonsi Go
67. Wild Nothing Gemini
68. Gonjasufi A Sufi & A Killer
69. Swans My Father Will Guide Me Up A Rope To The Sky
70. No Age Everything In Between
71. Owen Pallett Heartland
72. Gold Panda Lucky Shiner
73. Deftones Diamond Eyes
74. Oneohtrix Point Never Returnal
75. Rick Ross Teflon Don
76. The-Dream Love King
77. Perfume Genius Learning
78. Broken Bells Broken Bells
79. Interpol Interpol
80. Eminem Recovery
81. Hakan Hellstrom 2 Steg Fran Paradiset
82. Zola Jesus Stridulum II
83. Superchunk Majesty Shredding
84. Roky Erickson & Okkervil River True Love Cast Out All Evil
85. Cee-Lo The Lady Killer
86. Agalloch Marrow Of The Spirit
87. Charlotte Gainsbourg IRM
88. The Gaslight Anthem American Slang
89. Kings Of Leon Come Around Sundown
90. Erykah Badu New Amerykah, Pt. 2
91. Broken Social Scene Forgiveness Rock Record
92. Glasser Ring
93. Drive-By Truckers The Big To-Do
94. Teenage Fanclub Shadows
95. Steve Mason Boys Outside
96. Twin Shadow Forget
97. Forest Swords Dagger Paths
98. Mount Kimbie Crooks & Lovers
99. Torche Songs For Singles
100. Enslaved Axioma Ethica Odini

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Arcade Fire is set to have a huge leap in ranking next update; if I do the math correctly, 419 points would put The Suburbs in the top 200, maybe the top 150.

Their album artist ranking will bump into the top 40 if that's the case, and maybe top 30...with an album in the top 40, top 150, and top 400.

Add to the fact that they had 3 singles in the top 100 of the decade on our decade endlists, and we're looking at AF probably placing in the 60s of all time.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I expect Kanye to end up at no.2, LCD Soundsystem to fall into 4th or 5th and Gorillaz to possibly climb into the top 10.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

This is actually the only place online that I've seen a good amount of people not like the new Kanye album. Its universal praise. Is it because ArchAndroid is somehow not #1 (an album that I had at #1 myself until Kanye knocked her off?) Is it Pitchfork backlash? I expected Kanye, Arcade Fire, LCD, and Joanna Newsom to fight for the top 4 spots this year, and besides the one exception (triple albums scare people away) that is what is going to happen.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

VanillaFire1000
This is actually the only place online that I've seen a good amount of people not like the new Kanye album. Its universal praise. Is it because ArchAndroid is somehow not #1 (an album that I had at #1 myself until Kanye knocked her off?) Is it Pitchfork backlash? I expected Kanye, Arcade Fire, LCD, and Joanna Newsom to fight for the top 4 spots this year, and besides the one exception (triple albums scare people away) that is what is going to happen.



After seeing the lists pouring out of the UK, I sort of wonder if rap in general is sort of exclusively an American cultural phenomenon(I know they have the Streets but meh...)

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think Deerhunter is going to make it into the top 5 after the next update

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

VanillaFire1000
This is actually the only place online that I've seen a good amount of people not like the new Kanye album. Its universal praise. Is it because ArchAndroid is somehow not #1 (an album that I had at #1 myself until Kanye knocked her off?) Is it Pitchfork backlash? I expected Kanye, Arcade Fire, LCD, and Joanna Newsom to fight for the top 4 spots this year, and besides the one exception (triple albums scare people away) that is what is going to happen.


Do you mean the year-end concensus or the AMF poll? For year-end concensus, I think we can attribute Kanye's lack of total domination to two factors

1. The UK music press: It's no secret that the UK music press doesn't like rap. I don't know if because it's too much of the "other" for them, or if its because rap doesn't sell very well in the UK. Regardless, the UK press has made it clear they care much more about random generic indie bands they decide to hype up as opposed to landmark releases.

2. Lilly-livered indie blogs: All of the "mainstream" US music sources (Pitchfork, Spin, Village Voice, AV club, etc.) are united in their praise of MBDTF as a total masterpiece. However, there are certainly a few US sources (such as DoA) that just wont put a black rap album at the top spot of their lists. Especially not in a year where Arcade Fire released an album.

Once all the lists are in, I think the top five will probably look like 1. Arcade Fire 2. Kanye West 3. LCD Soundsystem 4. The National 5. Janelle Monae. I'm not really too concerned though, because as time goes on Kanye will take the first spot.

As for the AMF EOY poll, I would be shocked if Kanye didn't come out on top. It's like what was written in the CMG blurb; there will be a few people who are like "over-rated" and everyone else will have it at #1 with a bullet.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I'm thinking it'll end up as:

1. Arcade Fire
2. Kanye West
3. LCD Soundsystem
4. The National
5. Beach House
6. Janelle Monae
7. Big Boi
8. Deerhunter
9. Gorillaz
10. The Black Keys

As an aside: I can get on board with Sound of Silver being top 5 in 2007 even though it wouldn't be in my personal top 5, and I understand TIHappening to an extent - though for me Gorillaz, Big Boi and Janelle are considerably more deserving - but I really think the LCD debut being in the top 5 for 2005 is silly. It's too patchy. And over Late Registration and Silent Alarm as well!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

SR
VanillaFire1000
This is actually the only place online that I've seen a good amount of people not like the new Kanye album. Its universal praise. Is it because ArchAndroid is somehow not #1 (an album that I had at #1 myself until Kanye knocked her off?) Is it Pitchfork backlash? I expected Kanye, Arcade Fire, LCD, and Joanna Newsom to fight for the top 4 spots this year, and besides the one exception (triple albums scare people away) that is what is going to happen.


Do you mean the year-end concensus or the AMF poll? For year-end concensus, I think we can attribute Kanye's lack of total domination to two factors

1. The UK music press: It's no secret that the UK music press doesn't like rap. I don't know if because it's too much of the "other" for them, or if its because rap doesn't sell very well in the UK. Regardless, the UK press has made it clear they care much more about random generic indie bands they decide to hype up as opposed to landmark releases.

2. Lilly-livered indie blogs: All of the "mainstream" US music sources (Pitchfork, Spin, Village Voice, AV club, etc.) are united in their praise of MBDTF as a total masterpiece. However, there are certainly a few US sources (such as DoA) that just wont put a black rap album at the top spot of their lists. Especially not in a year where Arcade Fire released an album.

Once all the lists are in, I think the top five will probably look like 1. Arcade Fire 2. Kanye West 3. LCD Soundsystem 4. The National 5. Janelle Monae. I'm not really too concerned though, because as time goes on Kanye will take the first spot.

As for the AMF EOY poll, I would be shocked if Kanye didn't come out on top. It's like what was written in the CMG blurb; there will be a few people who are like "over-rated" and everyone else will have it at #1 with a bullet.


The UK lists will put a rap album on top, but only if it comes from the UK (See: Streets, The.) When we do the AMF poll, I don't think Kanye will win because there are definitely a few outspoken people here who have come out against it, probably enough to keep it out of the top spot (with a usual sample size around 20-30, something like the ArchAndroid or even High Violent could sneak in because they look like they are in everyone's top 5.) My prediction was actually for what I expected the critics to do. I don't know why Have One On Me has been forgotten. Everyone kinda likes it, but I think that the album is ultimately forgettable, very adult-contemporary.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Just to satisfy my own curiosity (and hone my shopping needs) and to give myself a preview of what the next EOY update might look like, I've been adding lists to the spreadsheet in a VERY rudimentary fashion, i.e., only concentrating on what John Lennon would call "the toppermost of the poppermost," as it were. I stopped with Tiny Mix Tapes, Consequence of Sound and Under the Radar, because at a certain point an EOY list becomes kind of like a microcosm of the AM 3000: the top 50 or so are more or less set in stone, and it's just a matter of tiny shifts after that.

Anyway, Ddiamondd's top 10 prediction...

Ddiamondd

1. Arcade Fire
2. Kanye West
3. LCD Soundsystem
4. The National
5. Beach House
6. Janelle Monae
7. Big Boi
8. Deerhunter
9. Gorillaz
10. The Black Keys

...is exactly what I ended up with, with the notable exception of #9 being SWIM instead of PLASTIC BEACH. I'm genuinely surprised by how well the Caribou album is doing.

I'm pretty sure that Shaun's next update will solidify that while, yes, it certainly looks like Arcade Fire is decisively running away with this bitch, Yeezy will have overtaken the closerthanthis LCD and The National for second place. I also have to say I'm impressed by the resilience of TEEN DREAM; I would have thought for sure that THE ARCHANDROID was a top 5 album, but BH appears to be holding it off.

Albums that are doing a LOT better than their Mega-Critic numbers would have predicted:
Gil Scott-Heron, I'M NEW HERE
MGMT, CONGRATULATIONS
Foals, TOTAL LIFE FOREVER
Titus Andronicus, THE MONITOR
Best Coast, CRAZY FOR YOU

Albums doing a lot worse:
Pantha du Prince, BLACK NOISE
Erykah Badu, NEW AMERYKAH PT. TWO
Roky Erickson w/ Okkervil River, TRUE LOVE CAST OUT ALL EVIL (a tremendous surprise, I think - it's having trouble even getting close to the top 100)
Paul Weller, WAKE UP THE NATION
Wyatt/Atzmon/Stephen, FOR THE GHOSTS WITHIN

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler

Anyway, Ddiamondd's top 10 prediction...
Ddiamondd

1. Arcade Fire
2. Kanye West
3. LCD Soundsystem
4. The National
5. Beach House
6. Janelle Monae
7. Big Boi
8. Deerhunter
9. Gorillaz
10. The Black Keys

...is exactly what I ended up with, with the notable exception of #9 being SWIM instead of PLASTIC BEACH. I'm genuinely surprised by how well the Caribou album is doing.


Well, the Gorillaz position was a bit of personal hopefulness, but it's great to see Caribou doing well. He has crafted an electronic album that has united everyone from Resident Advisor to NME to Pitchfork in strong praise, and wholeheartedly deserves the top 10 slot.

I do expect to see Plastic Beach rising from #16, even a small amount.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think a lot of the backlash over Kanye's album has to do with the things he's getting praised for. Reviews seem to talk about 'Artist as cultural phenomenon' rather than 'Artist as musician'. They rate his music higher because he hijacks and charity event to accuse Bush of racism and runs on stage during the grammies, then talks about the backlash in his lyrics. If you're not into rap culture and all the associated boasting, your response is going to be "Who the hell cares? Talk abuot the music!"

I'm also not sure his album would be appearing so high on end of year lists if his album came out in, say, April, instead of November. It took me three or four listens before I realized I only liked the album for three or four really good singles. Contrarily, if Sir Luscious Left Foot came out in November, it'd be the one getting all the praise. It's the same way that all the films pining for Oscars come out in December. (Kanye knew exactly what he was doing.)

Personally I think 2010 might be the best year for new music since 1991, and that The Archandroid is all time top 50 worthy.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think the reason most critics haven't gone "in-depth" discussing the music is because it's just so self-evident. Like what are you going to write about something like Lost in the World or Monster? You can only say the production is the best I've ever heard in my life so many times. MBDTF is so varied and expansive, and covers so much ground that it could be a little intimidating to really do a song by song break down.

Your criticism of it only having a few strong singles seems particularly off-base to me. You could probably say that about College Dropout or Late Registration, but I think MBDTF is remarkable for being such a "no filler" album. All the tracks are uniformly strong except for maybe Hell of a Life, but hey, even OK Computer has Electioneering. If I had to do a track breakdown I would do something like this

Dark Fantasy - 8/10
Gorgeous - 9/10 (Raekwon's verse!)
Power - 9/10
All of the Lights/Interlude - 8/10
Monster - 10/10
So Appalled - 8/10
Devil in a New Dress - 8/10
Runaway - 9/10
Hell of a Life - 7/10
Blame Game - 8/10
Lost in the World/Who Will Survive in America - 10/10

If MBDTF was released in April, there would have been a lot of hype and fanfare, then things likely would have quieted down for a little while.... until December when it's resurrected and tops almost all of the US music lists. If anything, MBDTF's November release date hurt it in the EOY polls, as some were put together too early for it.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Yeah, Joanna Newsom has been underperforming. I also expected top 10 and all that, but at least is doing better than The Milk-Eyed Mender did in 2004 and i do think that Have One on Me will gain more respect over the years, it will only be forgotten if Newsom outdo herself next time around. And looking to the bright side of the thing: It's amazing how a forgettable adult contemporary triple Joanna Newsom album still manages to be the most critically acclaimed singer/songwriter release of the year, underperforming Laura Marling, Sufjan Stevens, Anais Mitchell and many others. Not that it was forgettable, at least not to me, it's still my favorite of 2010. And MBDTF doesn't sucks, is awesome and all that. I just wish music critics spoke more about the music than his persona. And the Chris Rock skit was horrific and some people think that that alone doesn't make the album worthy of #1 of the year. But if the #1 album has to be flawless: Archandroid has that horrific of Montreal jam and second half loses some steam; Arcade Fire wastes time in Suburbs with tracks like Rococo and Sprawl I (part II is awesome) that are just not as good as others and actually a waste of time to some people; This is Happening has been dubbed by some as sub-Sound of Silver and J Newsom made a 2h record that looks unremarkable as a whole. What i'm trying to say is that every release has been subject of some criticism this year: Crazy for You is the same song 13 times; Sufjan Stevens overexperiments and overproduce many tracks; High Violet is Coldplay to hipsters; Gorillaz diss Hip-Hop and can't get away with it, Laura Marling isn't old enough to speak about husbands; Vampire Weekend was pure filler and Yeasayer is Animal Collective to those who doesn't get AC. My point is: I don't think that, among people, there will be a consensus of the ultimate release of the year. I honestly liked them all, this is an amazing year and hard to pick a sole favorite, i guess is only Have One on Me cause i got personally attached to it, but in terms of quality, they have been all pretty equal.

But i would also like to point out that this was a year with some greats new artists and is bad that some of them are not getting as much attention because of the big household names that returned. And I also would like to point that every big name that came back this year released a fine overall solid album (even MGMT and MIA to some). But only two of them manage to release career best albums: Beach House (out of nowhere and builds over everything they released so far, incredibly consistent indie pop album) and Titus Andronicus. I'd include Gorillaz and The National in this group, but they have released terrific records in the past, so fans could argue if they are their peaks; but Teen Dream and The Monitor are undoubtedly career best recordings. Now these are albums i'd be proud to see making at least the top 20 of the year (2010 is too good to name only 10 albums and Teen Dream is inside the top 5! yay!)

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Sufjan Stevens overexperiments and overproduce many tracks;

Overproduced is a word indie critics made up to mean it sounds to "POP" but since Prince and Kanye and Robyn are POP they don't want to use the word pop to sound negative so they use "overproduced" to hide the fact that they can't stand when their favorite indie acts go pop(Liz Phair!!!!!). Yet two of the most acclaimed albums of the last 20 years are CLEARLY overproduced: Loveless, one of the most expensive albums ever made and of course Funeral so in a way they are contradicting themselves because they would NEVER use the words Loveless and overproduced in the same sentence.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I don't fully agree Loveless is overproduced, but i understand your point. I guess is a very raw work, the vocals are mixed into the instrumental, they don't overcome the guitars, it's not POP (unless you compare to their previous work), but also no early Sonic Youth. I guess it was just accessible. It's a beautiful work. And Arcade Fire's Funeral is one of those album that you just can't label, to me. There's indie rock, there's pop and there's some Bjork there (look at Haiti) and i guess that The Suburbs, especially Sprawl 2, is here to prove that they are not afraid to record accessible pop music.

I meant Overproduced as excess, and that's the main criticism to Adz. Look at Too Much: starts like someone is throwing up, then comes the synths, saxs, sounds all over the place. Same happens in a lot of spots of the album. There are too many things happening at the same time and not all of them grabs you or fully justify its place there. And i dig it, but some call it pretentious, excessive, pushing the songs to an average quality, actually hurting them instead of enhancing it. And the Kid A and Merriweather comparisons were even laughable to some. So, I know a lot of people over here thinks it's a landmark album that will gain respect over the years, but many thought it was terribly overambitous and an experiment gone wrong and that hurts the album EOY performance. I do like the record though. It's not Sufjan gone POP or something accessible, actually is pretty cerebral. Teen Dream was a pop accessible album, and i don't see a lot of people calling it overproduced. Even the hipsters call it the best pop album of the year.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Tim E
Sufjan Stevens overexperiments and overproduce many tracks;

Overproduced is a word indie critics made up to mean it sounds to "POP" but since Prince and Kanye and Robyn are POP they don't want to use the word pop to sound negative so they use "overproduced" to hide the fact that they can't stand when their favorite indie acts go pop(Liz Phair!!!!!). Yet two of the most acclaimed albums of the last 20 years are CLEARLY overproduced: Loveless, one of the most expensive albums ever made and of course Funeral so in a way they are contradicting themselves because they would NEVER use the words Loveless and overproduced in the same sentence.


I wouldn't use the word "overproduced" or "overexperiments" to describe Age of Adz. I just think it sucks. I mean, I could see how someone might say that something like Impossible Soul "overexperiments," but really I would just call it poor artistic judgement.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

SR
Tim E
Sufjan Stevens overexperiments and overproduce many tracks;

Overproduced is a word indie critics made up to mean it sounds to "POP" but since Prince and Kanye and Robyn are POP they don't want to use the word pop to sound negative so they use "overproduced" to hide the fact that they can't stand when their favorite indie acts go pop(Liz Phair!!!!!). Yet two of the most acclaimed albums of the last 20 years are CLEARLY overproduced: Loveless, one of the most expensive albums ever made and of course Funeral so in a way they are contradicting themselves because they would NEVER use the words Loveless and overproduced in the same sentence.


I wouldn't use the word "overproduced" or "overexperiments" to describe Age of Adz. I just think it sucks. I mean, I could see how someone might say that something like Impossible Soul "overexperiments," but really I would just call it poor artistic judgement.


I think The Age of Adz is brilliant throughout and exercises amazing artistic judgment. Sufjan obviously went through some dark times since Illinois, and the album feels like a sonic representation of the battle for his mind, body and soul. It feels like all of the bells and whistles are there to demand your attention so that his messages are able to sink in. And as such, he achieved something remarkable to me- he managed to create a 74+ minute album for an increasingly ADD audience whose sonic grandiosity is only surpassed by the emotional and spiritual resonance it offers.

Meanwhile, Arcade Fire have far less worthy material for an album, yet they fill it to the gills with 16 songs. And that's supposedly the album of the year.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

HRS
I don't fully agree Loveless is overproduced, but i understand your point. I guess is a very raw work, the vocals are mixed into the instrumental, they don't overcome the guitars, it's not POP (unless you compare to their previous work), but also no early Sonic Youth. I guess it was just accessible. It's a beautiful work. And Arcade Fire's Funeral is one of those album that you just can't label, to me. There's indie rock, there's pop and there's some Bjork there (look at Haiti) and i guess that The Suburbs, especially Sprawl 2, is here to prove that they are not afraid to record accessible pop music.

I meant Overproduced as excess, and that's the main criticism to Adz. Look at Too Much: starts like someone is throwing up, then comes the synths, saxs, sounds all over the place. Same happens in a lot of spots of the album. There are too many things happening at the same time and not all of them grabs you or fully justify its place there. And i dig it, but some call it pretentious, excessive, pushing the songs to an average quality, actually hurting them instead of enhancing it. And the Kid A and Merriweather comparisons were even laughable to some. So, I know a lot of people over here thinks it's a landmark album that will gain respect over the years, but many thought it was terribly overambitous and an experiment gone wrong and that hurts the album EOY performance. I do like the record though. It's not Sufjan gone POP or something accessible, actually is pretty cerebral. Teen Dream was a pop accessible album, and i don't see a lot of people calling it overproduced. Even the hipsters call it the best pop album of the year.


Well to me overproduced is not a bad word at all. I guess that would mean "underproduced" is considered lofi which is fine when you're starting out but when your selling a decent amount of your music and start selling out venues to me it just seems pointless to continue making music that sounds vintage and cheap. Move out of the garage already ;-)To me it's patronizing to your fans. I don't want to hear another Exile in Guyville when I know Liz is doing well enough to produce a good modern sounding record. What I like about Sufjan is he's only a soloist, (no backing band like Bruce, Costello or Prince) but he makes well produced big sounding music (in addition to his singer/songwriting material which isn't my cup of tea).

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Rocky Raccoon
It still makes me laugh how so many posters on this site state their own personal tastes and ideas on what is "the best" music as if they are carved-in-stone facts.

To critisize any list, or culmination of lists, is silly. It's called "difference of opinion" and in any subjective field, such as music, it's bound to happen.

If your favorite album or albums aren't doing as well as you think they should on these year-end lists, then maybe it's time just to admit you're in a minority with your adoration.


Great points!

I understand that my view is every bit as subjective and flawed as anyone else. But, it pays to be open to understanding why others have different perspectives regarding artistic and expressive works.

Just because I prefer smoother and more understandable vocal deliveries, doesn't mean that I can't learn to appreciate vocals that are not clearly the best in these two characteristics.

When someone expresses disdain for one of my favorite artists or songs, I understand that I will not appreciate the artist or song any more by ignoring a reasonably expressed critique.

For example, I still think that Stairway to Heaven is a great song. But, I find it very easy to understand others who find it lacking in terms of lyrics and to be terribly over-played.

On the other hand, I do not always fully appreciate some of the their other rather extensive criticisms of STH; but I would readily admit that they are (could be) reasonable and insightful, despite my difficulty in fully appreciating them.

One of the reasons I very much appreciate the give and take on AM is that the discussions are typically respectful and civilized - and more often than not based on very thoughtful analysis and/or heartfelt experience of a song or an artist.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I think people just tend to call something overproduced when they really mean it's poorly or blandly produced. By the strict definition of the word, you could call Loveless an overproduced album because of the sheer amount of time and effort it took to make. However, this production made it sound like no other album, whereas most albums saddled with the "overproduced" label tend to sound generic or boring. I haven't heard the Sufjan album, but to me The Suburbs can justifiably be called overproduced. There's for sure a lot going on, but it comes together to make such a bland whole that it's hard to tell many of the tracks apart. Its current AOTY status is based solely on AF's reputation, the length and ambition of the album, and critics' desire for the band to make another masterpiece to justify Funeral's status.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Jackson
Its current AOTY status is based solely on AF's reputation, the length and ambition of the album, and critics' desire for the band to make another masterpiece to justify Funeral's status.


You shouldn't put all the fans of the album into one group like that. I actually loved The Suburbs on purely musical terms. No matter what band made it, it would've been one of my favorites of 2010. It's okay if you weren't crazy about it, but don't go generalizing about those that are.

On another note, I think you're overstating the tendency of critics to feel "obligated" to raise an album up just because of the artist's past reputation. That may happen to an extent with reviews; a work may get initially overpraised the month it arrives. But come EOY time, I doubt critics would put an album on their personal lists if they didn't love it themselves. Think about it, if this were the case, The Age of Adz would've been just as high. Critics might cheat themselves while writing a review, but not while compiling a personal list with the guidance of hindsight. There's a good reason The Suburbs is push and shove with MBDTF as the year's best. At least that's my thinking.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I did the factor analysis yesterday, using the top 200 albums on the list and all 30 lists.

F1 positive:
Arcade Fire - The Suburbs
LCD Soundsystem - This Is Happening
The National - High Violet
Beach House - Teen Dream
Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot
Janelle Monae - The ArchAndroid
The Black Keys - Brothers
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Deerhunter - Halcyon Digest
Vampire Weekend - Contra

Rap vs noise pop?
F2 positive:
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot
Drake - Thank Me Later
Robyn - Body Talk
Rick Ross - Teflon Don
Jamey Johnson - The Guitar Song
Eminem - Recovery
The Roots - How I Got Over
Titus Andronicus - The Monitor
Neil Young - Le Noise

F2 negative:
These New Puritans - Hidden
Laura Marling - I Speak Because I Can
Foals - Total Life Forever
Edwyn Collins - Losing Sleep
Villagers - Becoming A Jackal
Gil Scott-Heron - I'm New Here
Field Music - Field Music (Measure)
Warpaint - The Fool
Hot Chip - One Life Stand
Everything Everything - Man Alive

Age factor?
F3 positive:
Robert Plant - Band Of Joy
The Black Keys - Brothers
Neil Young - Le Noise
Paul Weller - Wake Up The Nation
Manic Street Preachers - Postcards From A Young Man
Grinderman - Grinderman 2
Kings Of Leon - Come Around Sundown
The Jim Jones Revue - Burning Your House Down
Gorillaz - Plastic Beach
Drive-By Truckers - The Big To-Do

F3 negative:
Emeralds - Does It Look Like I'm Here?
Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot
Sufjan Stevens - The Age Of Adz
Salem - King Night
Darkstar - North
Flying Lotus - Cosmogramma
Crystal Castles - Crystal Castles
Pantha Du Prince - Black Noise
Liars - Sisterworld
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy

Indie-folk factor?
F4 positive:
The-Dream - Love King
Drake - Thank Me Later
Yeasayer - Odd Blood
Robert Plant - Band Of Joy
Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot
Ariel Pink's Haunted Graffiti - Before Today
Salem - King Night
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Neil Young - Le Noise
Hakan Hellstrom - 2 Steg Fran Paradiset

F4 negative:
The Tallest Man On Earth - The Wild Hunt
Mumford & Sons - Sigh No More
Band Of Horses - Infinite Arms
Titus Andronicus - The Monitor
The Walkmen - Lisbon
The Black Keys - Brothers
The National - High Violet
LCD Soundsystem - This Is Happening
Aloe Blacc - Good Things
Beach House - Teen Dream

Aggression factor?
F5 positive
Joanna Newsom - Have One On Me
Mavis Staples - You Are Not Alone
Sufjan Stevens - The Age Of Adz
Deerhunter - Halcyon Digest
Ariel Pink's Haunted Graffiti - Before Today
Field Music - Field Music (Measure)
Grinderman - Grinderman 2
John Grant - Queen Of Denmark
Sharon Jones & The Dap-Kings - I Learned The Hard Way
Owen Pallett - Heartland

F5 negative:
Drake - Thank Me Later
Eminem - Recovery
Interpol - Interpol
Everything Everything - Man Alive
Two Door Cinema Club - Tourist History
Band Of Horses - Infinite Arms
No Age - Everything In Between
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
My Chemical Romance - Danger Days
The Drums - The Drums

Rap vs indie pop?
F6 positive:
The Roots - How I Got Over
Gil Scott-Heron - I'm New Here
Grinderman - Grinderman 2
Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
Drake - Thank Me Later
Yeasayer - Odd Blood
Pantha Du Prince - Black Noise
These New Puritans - Hidden
Paul Weller - Wake Up The Nation
Eminem - Recovery

F6 negative:
Beach House - Teen Dream
Caribou - Swim
Hakan Hellstrom 2 - Steg Fran Paradiset
Roky Erickson & Okkervil River - True Love Cast Out All Evil
Robyn - Body Talk
The-Dream - Love King
Tracey Thorne - Love & Its Opposite
The Drums - The Drums
Arcade Fire - The Suburbs
Midlake - The Courage Of Others

Metal factor?
F7 positive:
Mumford & Sons - Sigh No More
Jamey Johnson - The Guitar Song
Swans - My Father Will Guide Me Up A Rope To The Sky
Drive-By Truckers - The Big To-Do
Superchunk - Majesty Shredding
Josh Ritter - So Runs The World Away
The Black Keys - Brothers
Justin Townes Earle - Harlem River Blues
Bruce Springsteen - The Promise
Titus Andronicus - The Monitor

F7 negative:
Torche - Songs For Singles
Coliseum - House With A Curse
Kylesa - Spiral Shadow
High On Fire - Snakes For The Divine
The Dillinger Escape Plan - Operation Paralysis
Enslaved - Axioma Ethica Odini
Kvelertak - Kvelertak
Rick Ross - Teflon Don
Watain - Lawless Darkness
Triptykon - Eparistera Daimones

Poppy melody factor?
F8 positive:
Pantha Du Prince - Black Noise
M.I.A. - Maya
Beach House - Teen Dream
Caribou - Swim
Matthew Dear - Black City
Gonjasufi - A Sufi & A Killer
Band Of Horses - Infinite Arms
The Gaslight Anthem - American Slang
Darkstar - North
Aloe Blacc - Good Things

F8 negative:
Sleigh Bells - Treats
Agalloch - Marrow Of The Spirit
Janelle Monae - The ArchAndroid
Jonsi - Go
Avi Buffalo - Avi Buffalo
Warpaint - The Fool
Joanna Newsom - Have One On Me
Vampire Weekend - Contra
Edwyn Collins - Losing Sleep
Titus Andronicus - The Monitor

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Sean Pak
Jackson
Its current AOTY status is based solely on AF's reputation, the length and ambition of the album, and critics' desire for the band to make another masterpiece to justify Funeral's status.


You shouldn't put all the fans of the album into one group like that. I actually loved The Suburbs on purely musical terms. No matter what band made it, it would've been one of my favorites of 2010. It's okay if you weren't crazy about it, but don't go generalizing about those that are.

On another note, I think you're overstating the tendency of critics to feel "obligated" to raise an album up just because of the artist's past reputation. That may happen to an extent with reviews; a work may get initially overpraised the month it arrives. But come EOY time, I doubt critics would put an album on their personal lists if they didn't love it themselves. Think about it, if this were the case, The Age of Adz would've been just as high. Critics might cheat themselves while writing a review, but not while compiling a personal list with the guidance of hindsight. There's a good reason The Suburbs is push and shove with MBDTF as the year's best. At least that's my thinking.


I imagine there still would be a tendency to rate albums highly by established critical darlings in year-end lists. I imagine that the hindsight you mention would come with decade-end lists or all-time lists, and is still a function of how recent the album is.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Rocky Raccoon

If your favorite album or albums aren't doing as well as you think they should on these year-end lists, then maybe it's time just to admit you're in a minority with your adoration.



Neutral Milk Hotel - In The Aeroplane Over The Sea

End of Year Lists:

Addicted to Noise (USA) - Albums of the Year: 18
Eye Weekly Canadian Critics Poll - Albums of the Year: 11
Village Voice (USA) - Albums of the Year: 15
Pop (Sweden) - Albums of the Year: 17
BigO (Singapore) - Albums of the Year: 12


I see what you did there..


edit: i'm actually on your site btw... bitching about eoy lists is kinda cute... i much rather prefer my categorical head givin' system:

party - no matter how stinky your balls, i'm drunk as hell and your top looks friigngxgyl jawsome...

tonsil - yeah, you're pretty meh-ok. sorry for not moving my lips, but at least this thingy keeps ticklin' your junk

toenail - uhh come on, it's sticking out of your body and has my saliva on it. pretty big time for a disappointment like you, right?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Why does it seem on every fandom site, every time people talk about their disagreement with other people's lists, one person feels the sanctimonious need to point out that people have different opinions?

Of course we're all only talking about our personal opinion. Just, conversation flows more naturally if you just say 'Best' without writing 'In my opinion' every other sentence.

This is why I prefer deeper statistical analyses than just adding together all the lists. If you dissect the different tastes, you can get personal lists for everybody rather than just getting the most agreed upon albums.

There are other reasons though that great albums appear lower on lists. A lot of albums haven't been heard by a lot of people. A lot of critics want to make sure they mostly list stuff their readers have already heard of. Older albums do better on all time lists, and more recent ones do better on EOY lists. There are several factors that impact an album's position besides just how much people like it.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

BillAdama
Why does it seem on every fandom site, every time people talk about their disagreement with other people's lists, one person feels the sanctimonious need to point out that people have different opinions?


because disagreement is futile. eoy lists are basically throwaway lists. the future is unwritten. bla bla bla. otherwise Exile On Main St'd still be one of the biggest bombs_EVAHHH..

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Moonbeam
Sean Pak
Jackson
Its current AOTY status is based solely on AF's reputation, the length and ambition of the album, and critics' desire for the band to make another masterpiece to justify Funeral's status.


You shouldn't put all the fans of the album into one group like that. I actually loved The Suburbs on purely musical terms. No matter what band made it, it would've been one of my favorites of 2010. It's okay if you weren't crazy about it, but don't go generalizing about those that are.

On another note, I think you're overstating the tendency of critics to feel "obligated" to raise an album up just because of the artist's past reputation. That may happen to an extent with reviews; a work may get initially overpraised the month it arrives. But come EOY time, I doubt critics would put an album on their personal lists if they didn't love it themselves. Think about it, if this were the case, The Age of Adz would've been just as high. Critics might cheat themselves while writing a review, but not while compiling a personal list with the guidance of hindsight. There's a good reason The Suburbs is push and shove with MBDTF as the year's best. At least that's my thinking.


I imagine there still would be a tendency to rate albums highly by established critical darlings in year-end lists. I imagine that the hindsight you mention would come with decade-end lists or all-time lists, and is still a function of how recent the album is.


But you're biased. I know from past threads that you're no fan of The Suburbs either. Heh, just kidding. I see what you're saying, but I still maintain that when putting personal lists together, critics will want to put stuff they actually liked. Any self respecting critic, anyway. And like I asked above, if it happened to The Suburbs why didn't it happen to artists with similar reputations who also put out decent albums this year? And I myself am evidence that maybe the hype IS warranted; I'm a pretty discerning listener and I loved The Suburbs. I say don't let your personal dislike of a work cloud your thoughts and make you conspiracy theorists. It's very possible that all the critics who listed The Suburbs liked it as I did.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I didn't mean to insult people who genuinely like The Suburbs--obviously, there are many of them. However, I do think the top three albums according to this list right now--The Suburbs, This is Happening, and High Violet--are rated as highly as they are as much because of the reputation of the artists as the albums' musical content. I've heard very few--if any--people say that the Arcade Fire or LCD Soundsystem albums are their best. Consensus on the National album places it about on par with Boxer. I think it's at least a possibility that critics view these albums so highly in EOY lists because they are safer picks due to the popularity of the artists. In time, I would expect these three albums to fall in acclaim while The ArchAndroid, MBDTF, Cosmogramma, and others rise.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

BillAdama
There are other reasons though that great albums appear lower on lists. A lot of albums haven't been heard by a lot of people. A lot of critics want to make sure they mostly list stuff their readers have already heard of. Older albums do better on all time lists, and more recent ones do better on EOY lists. There are several factors that impact an album's position besides just how much people like it.


You have some great points, Jackson. If I had to put an overall logic to it, I would say it's a combination of what me and you said and what BillAdama said in the quote I chose. Those three albums have probably been chosen the most often because they ARE by three already-legendary artists and 'cause their new albums, though they may be lesser works, are "safe" choices, heard by most people. So that goes with what you and Bill both said. But remember, those three are still very good to great albums in their own right. Whether High Violet or This Is Happening are as strong as their predecessors or not, I still listen to and enjoy them both regularly, and would put them on my own list of the 20 to 30 or so best albums of the year. So while it's true that they may have placed so highly because of the artists who made them, they only placed at all because they're very good albums by any measure. I still don't think critics would have listed them if they hadn't personally enjoyed them enough to think they were deserving to be on their lists in the first place. Hope this post was clearer than how it sounded in my head.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

When will the next spreadsheet update be?

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Jackson
I didn't mean to insult people who genuinely like The Suburbs--obviously, there are many of them. However, I do think the top three albums according to this list right now--The Suburbs, This is Happening, and High Violet--are rated as highly as they are as much because of the reputation of the artists as the albums' musical content. I've heard very few--if any--people say that the Arcade Fire or LCD Soundsystem albums are their best. Consensus on the National album places it about on par with Boxer. I think it's at least a possibility that critics view these albums so highly in EOY lists because they are safer picks due to the popularity of the artists. In time, I would expect these three albums to fall in acclaim while The ArchAndroid, MBDTF, Cosmogramma, and others rise.


That's also why some albums that got mixed reviews rank higher than ones that recieved basically universal acclaim...Compare R.E.M.'s Out of Time to the same band's Reckoning. Reckoning has universal 4 to 5 star reviews; Out of Time has several low scores. However, Out of Time was much more successful, and thus has a much higher ranking, based on more critics being familiar with the album.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Any news about the next update, Shaun?

Many thanks in advance!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler


Albums doing a lot worse than their Mega-Critic numbers would have predicted:
Pantha du Prince, BLACK NOISE
Erykah Badu, NEW AMERYKAH PT. TWO
Roky Erickson w/ Okkervil River, TRUE LOVE CAST OUT ALL EVIL (a tremendous surprise, I think - it's having trouble even getting close to the top 100)
Paul Weller, WAKE UP THE NATION
Wyatt/Atzmon/Stephen, FOR THE GHOSTS WITHIN
Let's add Anais Mitchell to that list. Her album ranks as #1 by UK critics according to Mega-critic, but is not included in any of the UK lists in the spreadsheet...

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Shaun, any kind of update would be more than welcome, no matter how many lists you've been able to add since the previous one. Hope everything's going well, and Happy New Year!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Hadestown has to be the most criminally underrated album in the last few years.

It's weird because every indie-listening forum I've been to raves about it, almost every critic who's reviewed it loved it. Yet, it doesn't get half the exposure the sort of albums that get the same buzz do. It's like, The Decemberists are allowed to get indie buzz with a mythologically inspired folk opera, but nobody else is.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler
Just to satisfy my own curiosity (and hone my shopping needs) and to give myself a preview of what the next EOY update might look like, I've been adding lists to the spreadsheet in a VERY rudimentary fashion, i.e., only concentrating on what John Lennon would call "the toppermost of the poppermost," as it were...


...and I decided to pick up where I left off, again mostly to satisfy my own curiosity and again only focusing on the top performers on the spreadsheet.

While we wait for the next official update, here's a VERY unofficial top 50:

1. Arcade Fire - The Suburbs
2. The National - High Violet
3. Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy
4. Beach House - Teen Dream
5. LCD Soundsystem - This is Happening
6. Janelle Monae - The ArchAndroid
7. Deerhunter - Halcyon Digest
8. Caribou - Swim
9. Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot: The Son of Chico Dusty
10. Vampire Weekend - Contra
11. Ariel Pink's Haunted Graffiti - Before Today
12. The Black Keys - Brothers
13. Joanna Newsom - Have One on Me
14. Sufjan Stevens - The Age of Adz
15. Gorillaz - Plastic Beach
16. Flying Lotus - Cosmogramma
17. Robyn - Body Talk
18. Sleigh Bells - Treats
19. These New Puritans - Hidden
20. Foals - Total Life Forever
21. Yeasayer - Odd Blood
22. Gil Scott-Heron - I'm New Here
23. MGMT - Congratulations
24. Four Tet - There is Love in You
25. John Grant - Queen of Denmark
26. Best Coast - Crazy for You
27. Grinderman - Grinderman 2
28. Gonjasufi - A Sufi & A Killer
29. Warpaint - The Fool
30. Crystal Castles - Crystal Castles [II]
31. Titus Andronicus - The Monitor
32. Laura Marling - I Speak Because I Can
33. Swans - My Father Will Guide Me Up a Rope to the Sky
34. Twin Shadow - Forget
35. The Drums - The Drums
36. The Roots - How I Got Over
37. Surfer Blood - Astro Coast
38. Neil Young - Le Noise
39. Hot Chip - One Life Stand
40. Broken Bells - Broken Bells
41. Owen Pallett - Heartland
42. Pantha Du Prince - Black Noise
43. Salem - King Night
44. Emeralds - Does It Look Like I'm Here?
45. The Walkmen - Lisbon
46. Oneohtrix Point Never - Returnal
47. No Age - Everything in Between
48. Avi Buffalo - Avi Buffalo
49. Villagers - Becoming a Jackal
50. Mount Kimbie - Crooks and Lovers

Again, but even more so now, the biggest surprise in the update is going to be Beach House. Arcade Fire continues to pace the field in Secretariat-like fashion, but #'s 2-5 are turning out to be a constantly shuffling group, with Janelle Monae and Deerhunter battling it out underneath and far behind them.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Thanks Harold!

Why is Beach House such a surprise? After all, it is the best album of the year.

Edit: What I really meant was that Beach House is #5 in my megacritic+RYM spreadsheet, so for me a top 5 position (or at least top 10) was expected IMO.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

The Pitchfork Readers Poll results showed this as a top 5:

1. Arcade Fire
2. Kanye
3. The National
4. Beach House
5. LCD

and I expect that's what we'll end up with. Over time it's likely Kanye will go to no.1 but for now...

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I hope Sufjan can break into the top 10 and Janelle into the top 5.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Has any of you had any news from Shaun ?
I mean it's beginning to be a worry.
Hey Shaun are you there ?
I think that somebody else should start working on the spreadsheet if Shaun doesn't show up this week.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

nicolas
Has any of you had any news from Shaun ?
I mean it's beginning to be a worry.
Hey Shaun are you there ?
I think that somebody else should start working on the spreadsheet if Shaun doesn't show up this week.
Harold and I have just discussed this via email. Harold is willing to take over and we came to the same conclusion that he will do so if we don't hear from Shaun this week.

Shaun, if you're reading this, please let us know the status of your work. Thanks!

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold, out of curiosity, how far did Robert Plant drop. The last update had it at number 23, and this one tells me it's outside the top 50.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Doug
Harold, out of curiosity, how far did Robert Plant drop. The last update had it at number 23, and this one tells me it's outside the top 50.


#53, I think. BOJ has only appeared on a couple of lists since the update. The same thing happened to Drake, who was also quite high on the initial spreadsheet.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

I love how well that MGMT have been doing. I seemed to be one of the few to truly enjoy that album when it first arrived, nearly as much as Oracular Spectacular. Now I'm feeling a little vindicated, haha. Very disappointed by the performance of Hadestown and Black Noise. I mean, Pantha du Prince didn't even make Mixmag's or DJ Mag's lists! If publications devoted to his genre aren't even giving him recognition, something is weird. Usually Wire takes in the more experimental electronica albums that don't get enough notice elsewhere, but it didn't make their Top 50 either!

Sorry to hear about the spreadsheet mishaps by the way. If i wasn't such a Luddite, I'd help out. I'm so anti-tech. I own a five year old computer. The latest game I've played was Baldur's Gate 2. I don't have a TV or video game console. Excel and Powerpoint confound me. I only know the simplest computer programs besides Cubase, which I'm still figuring out after a couple years. One day I'll get well enough with spreadsheets to lend a hand. It's the least I could do after using this site so much.

Re: EOY 2010 spreadsheet

Harold Wexler
Doug
Harold, out of curiosity, how far did Robert Plant drop. The last update had it at number 23, and this one tells me it's outside the top 50.


#53, I think. BOJ has only appeared on a couple of lists since the update. The same thing happened to Drake, who was also quite high on the initial spreadsheet.


Bummer...I picked it up the other day after seeing how well it was doing on the first spreadsheet, and I really like what I'm hearing. Hopefully, it'll get some love on some later lists.

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