Hi Ron, thanks for your input. Having just seen your G3, I wondered how the hell mine won best Military Machine In Show at Stafford this this year as mine has one or two "in service" modifications and is no where near as 'factory fresh' as yours. If I had known about the numbering sequence when I was forced to do a total rebuild of the bike in 2016 after being 'T' boned by a lady in a car and the bike ending up on top of me on fire, I would have gone with the numbering sequence that you and Jan provided. However at the time, I only had photographs of the bike as it was when I bought it and prior to the off. Interestingly though, there is a coincidence coming out of my research as my late dad was in the RASC serving first in Egypt and later in Palestine and the phot I have of him would have been on one of the machines from contract. My reason for purchasing the G3 was finding that phot in his personal effects following his death in 2009.
Thanks once again for your kind help.
Neil
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
Well I've owned mine for probably around 20 years, so plenty of time for research and revisiting it with corrections and upgrades.
Be good if you posted a picture of your Dad and his bike. Or email it to me and I'll post it if you want.
Cheers Ron
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Neil's bike just after the fire brigade put it out, and then after he restored it again. Ron
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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Here's Neil's Dad in Palestine. In fact a Norton. One for Rik! Ron
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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
FIY, The family has a picture taken in the same location with dad on a G3 which was his favourite mount, but it is not in my possession.
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
The fire was the result of me being invisible (I was wearing a Hein Gericke hi vis textile riding jacket and trousers and the headlight was on) coming back from The Brighton Bash where I’d had my bike on the club stand, I was about a mile and a half from home and a woman who was waiting to cross the urban dual carriageway I was on pulled out on me when I was about 2 to 3 metres from her T boning me, breaking my wrist and the bike landing on top of me and catching fire. The fire I suspect being caused by the headlamp bezel flying off when the bike hit the ground and the wiring shorting out.
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
Well there's your problem. All that Hi Viz and million candle wat headlamp must have dazzled her!!!:scream: Ron
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Three guesses what four words came out of the woman’s mouth …….. anybody?
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
The normal reply is I didn't see you. Uttered many times.
Jan, Am I right in thinking that the RASC stamped the C number on their crankcases. I have 2 examples of this practice. Cheers, JT
John, this was the case, roughly up until the invasion of the Low Countries in May 1940. These numbers were stamped by the RASC, as they all have the same "style" (the C being taller than the number itself).
Prior to late 1939 there was only one census numbers system, RASC and RAOC numbers were all mixed up. The only logic in the system being that the census number always started with the year (e.g. 3712345). The RASC bikes always (?) had their census number stamped on the crankcases:
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From late 1939 onwards, the RASC started using their own census numbers system, starting somewhere around 60000. And of course, these RASC census numbers were still stamped on the crankcases, same style:
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As explained, this habit stopped around May 1940. The RASC still had its own numbering system, but the numbers were no longer stamped on the engine. Also when the RASC and RAOC numbers were amalgamated again in 1942, we have no more census numbers stamped on the engines.
Would be interested in the examples that you have!
Jan
email (option): wd.register@gmail.com
I don't know why nobody asked me, as I have this bike on file, and the C number was 93125, the postwar ERM number was 46YA08, it was struck of the list on 08-10-1958 (Neil, what's the first registration date? should be after this date), at the location NID, which is an unknown for me, anyone?
The KeyCard number where it is on is 94a. I'll check it later today on the actual card, a high res scan is available from me for 20 euro's
Cheers,
Lex
email (option): welbike@welb***.net
Which proves my point... You can't calculate census numbers for the early RASC contracts.
The census number that was found in the Key Cards (C93125) seems like miles away from the number C96975 ("plus or minus 100") that I calculated. But it is actually quite close, if we consider that there are gaps in the census numbers blocks for this contract (C92889 - C93358, C95889 - C96828).
But still no logic:
- The Key Card census number C93125 is the 237th census number from contract C7183
- Frame number 7828 is the 829th frame from contract C7183
- Engine number 10341 is the 115th engine from contract C7183 (no "matching numbers" on a Matchless, so this could have been a replacement engine, although in my opinion this is doubtful)
- Census number C93125 is the 237th census number from contract C7183...
Jan
email (option): wd.register@gmail.com
Yes, Jan, you told me first, that it was impossible, with my WD-C, so why did you try? I think, the bikes went from the factory, to an RASC depot, and parked in rows, and wherever they were parked they got a Census number, nobody looked at the framenumbers, too much work.
Haven't looked into the engine number yet, I will check in the afternoon. Would you say the C number on the engine was added as the C number was painted on the petrol tank? this must have been a lot of work, and as you said, soon discarded.
Cheers,
Lex
email (option): welbike@welb***.net
Hi Lex,
The first registration date was 28 January 1959, the engine number is stamped CW10341 indicating it was issued to the RASC which was my late fathers corps. Any further information would be gratefully received.
Please let me know what your banking details are so that I can send you the 20 Euros for the scan of the card. NID is Northern Ireland and correlates to its first registration. I have Northern Irish MOT discs for the bike and it’s English registration plate is age related..
Regards Neil
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
First off I’d like to thank you all for the information that you have given me, especially Lex for the copy of the Key Card. I’m going to remove the spurious census number from the tank and have a dummy military number plate that I can put over the civvie one at shows. However, I am not sure whether to put the correct census number on the tank or on the front number plate as I have seen on early photos of bikes of the same period opinions would be welcome.
Neil
email (option): neil.trinder01@gmail.com
The early RAOC bikes had their census number on the left hand side of the petrol tank, in white letters on a black rectangle. Not so with the early RASC bikes, here the census number was applied rather crudely on both sides of the (black) front numberplate. The RAOC clearly had a good signwriter to do the job, but the RASC numbers were definitely not done by a signwriter!
email (option): wd.register@gmail.com
Neil's correct number. Ron
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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com