Neither would be easy for me to make Ian as my metal work skills go no further than straightening bent parts and a bit of welding and anything more than that I am out of my depth. In the case that my bike would have been fitted with an MT110 type lamp I would have no issues at all in using the Czech made item and will be a lot better than no light at all or a bodged up original. Should the right one come along it could be swapped over easily enough.
However being from Cornwall what I will not be doing is paying £700 plus for a rear light or any other light or component for that matter. I would like to get the bike as near is it was when it landed in France but in a realistic way and i am not adverse to using pattern items if they are well made and fairly accurate copies and there is no other choice and so far there are no pattern parts on my project. i have a fe replica parts coming and will have to buy a few more but surely it is better to complete the bike and get it back in action again than leave it as an incomplete project in the attic!
Mike.

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

What serial number is it that you need Rik? I only have the frame number which is WM20 6227 ( engine number is later and from May 1940) and the contract number which was C/5110 and was kindly given to me by another member of the group. According to what I have seen it was despatched on the 2/10/39.
However i am sure it must be complicated to fully understand what was made when and exactly at which point parts changed.We are lucky there are some surviving records for these bikes!
Mike.

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

Hi Ron, my bike really was a basket case with numerous parts missing and I have been lucky enough to find what I have so far.
The only electrical parts I have is the 8" headlamp shell and a reflector which I need to confirm if it is correct or not and a damaged switch which I believe may be of the type you oare talking about. Off T L H is this the one? Several years a go I bought a NOS switch of the same type still in its military packaging so I have a switch of this type but not the earlier one.
I don't have an ammeter of any type nor the rear light.
I do have several old regulator boxes of MCR1 and MCR2 type and I presume one or the other of these will be correct and I presume MCR1?
I also have a flat frosted type headlight glass but it does not have the black dot in the center of it.
I have no handlebar switches at all nor the lever assemblies.
Mike.

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

Yes that switch of yours will be ideal. The black dot you refer to is the Lucas Defusa logo and are available for a few pence from "Classic Transfers". The MCR1 is correct and an electronic DVR2 solid state regulator will fit easily inside if it doesn't work. The BSA pre-war levers are sometimes available at a price, so best put up a shout if you want them. Ron

PS here is Jiri's site https://www.vintage-replica.cz/indexE.htm

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Hi Mike...Are you in France or Cornwall at the moment?....Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Ian, I am trapped in France at the moment forced to live on wine and cheese and spend my time dragging M20's outof bomb craters!!!
Only joking of course but I am In France and unable to get back due to Covid and then probably will not be able to get back in to France again.
How is retirement treating you?
Cheers, Mike.

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

I've seen quite a number of NOS 'Difusa' glasses in original packaging with no transfer....It's quite possible that they weren't too fussy for the military market.

Lokking at numbers, C5110 commenced at WM20 5001 and the first machines arrived at RAOC Chilwell on 22nd September 1939. It looks as if the first 2000 were in accordance with the contract and were numbered C3928419 - C3931195. This would make yours, probably C3929645...unless perhaps Rob Miller can extrapolate anything different from the 'Key cards'. Up until at least C3935651 seem to have had the MT1130 rear lamp (The 'Gucci' expensive one !)so it seems fair to say that the first 2000 all did.

This is the closest after yours that I have on file...C3930071 - It ought to be WM20 6653. The MT1130 is clearly visible.



Definitely still Ni-Fe batteries at this stage, as Ron has suggested.



If you want to enter the realms of rivet-counting (it is a dark place from where there is no return !:grinning: ) then perhaps you should know that the MCR1 regulator ought to be marked 'Ni-Fe' too...They had a different charging rate.

This base is dated '10 9' (October 1939 under the Lucas system)

Hi Rik, yet again many thanks for all the very interesting information and the great photos. I am starting to think that my bike has gone from being an illegitimate orphan to one that has just discovered who its parents are if you know what I mean! It is going from a pile of parts in to an almost complete machine that has some definate history which makes me very happy.
I don't really understand how the contract numbers work but anything else that can be found out about the bike would be very interesting.
I am not exactly a rivet counter but for the rest of the parts I need I will try and find the period correct parts if I can and if not use the nearest thing to it untill I can find the right part as I have done so far.
In any case it seems that you have narrowed the bike down to a definate group of machines which should confirm the specs of my particular bike and I have already started to raise funds for all the exotic things I need such as the rear light,levers and Ammeter but sadly standing on the street corner all morning has only raised 3 euros so there is some way to go!!
Once again many thanks for your assistance and the others who have contributed information.
Regards, Mike.

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

The way I see it Mike, each batch of vehicles were ordered under a contract to which the War Office agreed to, or stipulated the specifications. The parts lists were printed for each contract and a plate was attached to each vehicle with it's contract number. That way the workshops knew which parts book to follow when ordering parts. Ron

The correct front and rear number plates are made by a forum member as a hobby. I'll ask him to email you off line. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Hi Ron, sadly I don't have one of those plates or any numbers on the tank as I assume they were removed by some French man many years a go so as the bike would no longer look like a military bike which he could not have registered for the road. I am no expert on military bikes but I have quite a few customers who quite obviously have got ex WD machines but few seem to be restored as such and it is more than usual for id numbers to have been removed and I am sure in most cases these bikes will be being used with a log book from another bike.
What I diden't understand about the numbering was the one that is usually found on the petrol tank and how it can be confirmed as being a specific number for a certain bike. Is there some records that show which bike had which number on the tanks?

email (option): mdew01@hotmail.co.uk

Each contract was a certain number of machines and the start and finish 'C' Numbers for each contract can be found from various sources...The first and last engine/frame numbers are also still in various records...So, using these numbers it's then a case of working out how far into the contract a bike is and from that the matching 'C' number (for the tank) can be calculated...That's probably how Rik will have arrived at the number he suggested for your bike...

I have one of the lights that can be converted to the correct rear light for your bike..I'll donate it 'free gratis' to the project if you want it...It's not too difficult to do and is the only way to go really unless you get lucky (very) or you're prepared to spend a lot of cash if/when an original turns up....Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Yes the numbers are recorded but they're not always straight forward. If you look back at Rik's last post, he's already had a stab at calculating yours. Ron

PS this book is our bible, which is backed up by other members who have copy's of Key Cards and Ledgers.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224455892171?epid=235165543&hash=item34429d1ccb:g:axwAAOSw~X1gfY6e

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Almost correct Rik! But according to the Key Cards, WM20.6227 comes from a block within contract C/5110 where the census number is 1 off the "logical" sequence. (And there were more census number anomalies in this contract by the way!) So WM20.6227 would have had census number C3929646 on the tank. And from the factory ledgers we know that it was despatched on 2/10/39.

Jan

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Thanks, Jan...I was deliberately a little cagey as I haven't done the detailed homework on M20s....


Here, by the way is C3929747, again confirming MT1130 and of course left hand speedo drive fitting as it's a WM.

That is a very close number Rik! And the picture was taken in France, definitely BEF!

Jan

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com