This is off topic but I'm interested to know if anyone is running a 'BTH' self generating electronic ignition mag replacement...
The unit looks similar to a magdyno and is simply fitted complete as a replacement for the original...For an upcoming project I like the idea of the improved spark at kick starting speeds and the 'built in' adv/rtd curve...
However, at £786 I'd be glad to hear from anyone who has working experience of the type before 'taking the plunge'! (or one of the other models such as the K2F replacement)...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
I have been using one of these on my A10 Super Rocket having got fed up with frequent dodgy mag rebuilds.
It transformed the bike. One or two kicks to start after 6 months lay up, great tickover and on matter how hard you snap the throttle shut at red traffic lights it never stalls. Dead easy to install and set up and maintenance free: I have never had to do anything to it since I originally installed it
I am very happy with it.
Thanks Dean...That sounds positive...Have you done many miles with it?...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Hi Ian
I have fitted 3 self generating BTH mags on my 3HW, WD M20 and my '59 Bonneville, have covered about 3500 miles on the 3HW,2000+ miles on the WM20 and 3000+ on the '59 with no issues at all, performance is defiantly improved, three friends have fitted them on their bikes on my recommendation and they still talk to me. Setting the timing is fool proof as you lock the drive shaft of the mag while you tighten the pinion up with no chance of it moving. Way better than spending money on refurbishing an old mag. Cheers Barry
email (option): deadhorsesdontgetbackup@hotmail.co.uk
Ian, my friend has one fitted to an Ariel used in classic racing and while the BTH mag works fine now it was supplied with a faulty coil.
The supplier refused to accept that the coil was faulty and my friend ended up fitting a coil sourced elsewhere.
Completely unacceptable for such an expensive unit.
It seems that their after-sales support is less than stellar so you might want to get an ironclad agreement regarding warranty before you purchase.
email (option): rays54@hotmail.com
Ian,
I put a 'New BTH' on my first old bike - a '49 G80S 3 years ago. Super easy to install, setup and looks amazing. Very good quality piece of kit.
The only thing I found, was that it always seemed to make the bike run and idle fast. I couldn't seem to tune out the fast idle when coming to a set of traffic lights, where, it would idle fast, for 30 seconds or more before it'd start to idle down. It did NOT do this with the original Lucas mag. It always made me feel self concious, as people would look and think "what's this boob doing with his bike revving"...
Otherwise- great bit of gear. Maybe my issue was caused by something I did... ?
email (option): marty.whyte@gmail.com
My mate Graham (last of the summer wine) has one on his Dommie. In his words. "Brilliant piece of kit" Horror has met the bike. Ron
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Thanks for the replies so far...Has anyone else had the 'fast idle' problem described by Marty?..Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Hi Ian
I've had no problem whatsoever with any of my bikes and neither have any of my fiends. Barry
email (option): deadhorsesdontgetbackup@hotmail.co.uk
I fitted a Thorspark ignition to my WM20. This replaces the points in the magneto and fires the coil (also supplied). Timing can be set perfectly with a strobe light after making an appropriate mark on the engine sprocket. This leaves the mag where it is but it's only function is to time the pickup. Advance still operates off the original cable and it is virtually invisible once installed. This works VERY well, my old girl starts first kick even if left in the back of my shed for 6 months. Not as fancy as the item described here but works really well. Drainage on battery is minimal - about 1/4 amp.
also, see this post
http://pub37.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=3155626639&frmid=16&msgid=1370049&cmd=show
Hi Ian,
I bought one for my WM20 at Stafford, directly from the manufacturer.
He and his missus were there, and they were very nice and serviceable,
So I believe that if you have any issues, as described here, (Coil or anything else) they would help.
I had few questions and I called the owner directly and he was very helpful.
The system works great on the WM20, but worth also mentioning:
1. You can have either a fixed ignition unit or auto-advance off BTH, both cost the same.
2. When they were selling at Stafford, there was a 50% discount, for the time of the fare.
(Maybe the same when selling elsewhere)
3. I have a “Powerdyno” on an M21
(Modified, so did not care about the originality. The system looks like a “Bosch” unit)
And it also works great, and if I remember correctly, the "BTH" auto advance is fixed,
But on the "Powerdynamo" you have a microswitch to choose one out of 4 pre-set timing maps already embedded,
And it comes complete with a 12V alternator, with 2 wires run out of it directly to the batt, which is great.
Cheers,
Noam.
Noam, can you do me a favour and give this lovely helpful chap a call and ask if he would be able to help with the faulty coil (100% proven)?
Sometimes people who have had face to face contact are completely different to how they react to email.
Please feel free to contact me offline and the results would no doubt be interesting for our friend Ian?
Best rgds, Ray
email (option): rays54@hotmail.com
Interesting thread. I know two people with a BTH mag both have had problems and both have had no joy with the manufactures. Both mags were fitted to BSA Super Rockets. One had an intermittent fault which turned out to be a faulty circuit board, this was fixed by another friend. The other one kept failing and was sent back many times to be told that there was no fault found. This now forms an expensive ornament in his garage. He rides his bike now with a problem free ordinary Lucas mag.
Hi Ray.
It was some 3 years ago and I doubt he remembers me...
I had his phone (Maybe even mobile) written on a piece of paper with the company details/ad,
And called him from London for details, after the event ended.
I will try to find it and update you.
Best regards,
Noam.
I have never used one of the BTH electronic ignitions but know three people who have. Two were fitted to Velocettes and one to an Ariel. All three failed after a few years. After contacting the company, no help was offered and "you must have done something wrong" so we can't help was their reply. All three went back to Lucas magnetos and no more problems.
Now as for magnetos, I don't understand why you would want to replace it with an electronic ignition? I will admit there are many individuals offering magneto rebuilding services and most have no idea what they are doing. There are only a few I would trust. As long as the windings don't need to be rewound, you can rebuild the magneto yourself and be confident it will work. The idea it is a complicated device no person can work on with out having been trained by Lucas is ridiculous. In 46 years of riding British bikes with magnetos, I have never been at the side of the road because the magneto failed. Most magneto problems are caused by the owner thinking it is a maintenance free device. It needs to be every few years (if you actually ride the bike) taken off the bike and cleaned and the bearings greased. It is no more complicated then the Lucas distributor on a car. Even condenser replacement is something you can do yourself.
I have twelve bikes with Lucas magnetos and all work perfectly. If rewinding is needed, I send the armature out but do everything else myself.
I guess this post reappeared after some spam was attached to it....In fact I'm enjoying reading some of these older discussions from a time when the forum was more heavily used, so there's something good about the irritating spammers.....I too have always stuck with magnetos and like Bruce don't ever recall getting stuck on the road with a mag failure when the mag has been competently rebuilt..My interest in the self generating systems was the electronic adv. curve, something that is effectively not available in any meaningful way on a manual adv/rtd magneto...
Hoever, the high cost, possibly poor customer service and the frequency of faults detailed in the original posts meant in the end that I'm still a happy Joe Lucas customer..:laughing: ....Ian
Just to echo some of the problems reported: fast tickover (incorrect advance curve maybe?) and random faults (including complete failure) compounded with poor customer service ie, refusal to accept the fault existed. This was on 2 units fitted to a Royal Enfield Constellation I worked on with a friend.
REgards, Mark
Off topic but I still have fond memories of my two Constellations...I've always thought Enfields to be generally underated...I recently came across a Meteor Minor 'shed find' which is tempting me..I also had one of those years ago which which was reimported from Uganda where it was ridden by a Vicar at a mission...Ian
Well as an Enfield enthusiast I would say they are underrated! I have a Meteor Minor myself, a rare "small frame" version. If you need assistance or encouragement I act as the REOC's Tech Advisor for the twins and I want to see more of them out there. I'm currently working on an oily rag Mk2 Interceptor and a 1939 alloy engined G just for contrast!
REgards, Mark
Hi Mark..I had many Redditch Enfields years back including some rarities...A Crusader Sports, Two Continental GTs (one with the full fairing), An ex factory alloy trials 350 model, two Constellations, a 350 Clipper, a J2, a Super 5 and one of the unit construction 350s....When I went to look at that one I didn't believe the seller initially as I'd never heard of one and was convinced it was a 250!!...and the Meteor Minor...
The current find is spread around a property less than a mile from me here in Devon so the search is on to find more of it...The engine and gearbox/clutch are complete, there are frame and forks and some other bits but as yet no wheels mudguards etc. etc....The old boy who had it was a hoarder who had about 5 old cars and sheds full of spares, model aeroplane motors, radio equipment, machine tools and engineering tooling, etc. etc. etc...and the house is full as well!!...The bike is all there..somewhere...A 1966 BSA C15F has already been recovered and returned to the road after reassembly....Ian
That's a fine selection! I've had most of those as well. including the 350 unit New Bullet and a genuine Bullet Works Replica lots of Interceptors etc etc. Currently working on a genuine 1939 Competition 350 Bullet with all alloy engine that originally went to a dealer in Torquay, Devon. Please feel free to contact me, as I say i have some knowledge on the MMs as well as some spares which it sounds like you may need! I'm at trials59(AT)yahoo(DOT)co(DOT)uk.
REgards, Mark
Thanks Mark...I'll let you know more about what's found as the clearing continues...What is the current spares situation like for the engine/gearbox of the Meteor Minor?....For the last 9 years I've owned a 2015 C5 EFI Enfield but I'm just in the process of getting rid of that..A nice bike until the electronics play up!! (like most modern bikes!:dizzy_face: )....Ian
Engine and gearbox parts availability is good with exceptions. All consumable parts are available for both. The Indian Bullet gearbox is pretty much identical to the Albion and parts supplied by a good supplier (ie Hitchcocks) are of good quality but avoid Indian Ebay sellers! Engine parts, valves shells pistons etc etc all available, even new camshafts. Heads barrels etc not available but plenty of good used about. Electrical all available with exception of distributor body and internals, the clockwise 18D2 dis is a bit of a rarity. As to the rest my big tip would be to rebuild to 18" or even 19" wheels from the original 17" as these machines are under geared (this can be fixed in the primary and gearbox sprocket) and lack ground clearance.
REgards, Mark
Thanks Mark...I used to get all my spares from Gander and Gray back in the day..I visited their shop a number of times when I was up in London for the main Motorcycle Show which was held in the Horticultural Halls in those days..What an Enfield 'Alladins cave'!!...Ian
Engine and gearbox parts availability is good with exceptions. All consumable parts are available for both. The Indian Bullet gearbox is pretty much identical to the Albion and parts supplied by a good supplier (ie Hitchcocks) are of good quality but avoid Indian Ebay sellers! Engine parts, valves shells pistons etc etc all available, even new camshafts. Heads barrels etc not available but plenty of good used about. Electrical all available with exception of distributor body and internals, the clockwise 18D2 dis is a bit of a rarity. As to the rest my big tip would be to rebuild to 18" or even 19" wheels from the original 17" as these machines are under geared (this can be fixed in the primary and gearbox sprocket) and lack ground clearance.
REgards, Mark
We heard you the first time Mark:smiley: :smiley: Good information though. Ron another advocate for RE.
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Cheers Ron, just flying the flag for Enfields!