Getting ready to paint my C-number and decal up the tank- but references seem to state the kneepads were deleted in 1943. However almost every picture I see shows kneepads on the tanks. I'm assuming this is the personal choice of most owners, rather than any attempt to be historically accurate.
At any point were the tapped holes deleted from the tanks? I understand the Vokes filter would need at least one of the holes on each side.
I plan to put some on my tank (the correct earlier style and not the 1950's type). Just curious if anybody chooses NOT to use them?

Obviously a question from an under 55 year old ?

There was a war on.

the Japanese had cut off 99% of rubber supplies.
thats the reason for canvas handlebar grips,no footest rubbers , no knee grips and the like.
what rubber, [synthetic]was about was needed for far more important items tham knee grips.

The weekly motorcycle magazines were full of exortations to save rubber and every little bit of paper, to run your tyres till they were smooth [!!!!]but not till the canvas showed through.

Today recycle amateurs have no idea about salvage.

email (option): deadsheds@yahoo.com

Yes Ken, I am in the sub-55 age group, no senior's discounts for me. Today's generation of "Recyclers" know nothing about what our parents and grandparents had to endure and Reduce, Reuse and Recycle meant a lot more to them than it does to us.
So technically the kneepads were not specified in the 1943-1944 period yet
seem to be quite common. I can appreciate the need for them , bouncing cross country on a girder-forked rigid frame M20 must be quite a chore with nothing for the knees to hold on with. Maybe the riders insisted on fitting them at the time?

if they fitted them they would have had to find from somewhere else.

They would not have had a menu of choices.
Army personel could not 'insist' on anything. no yuman rights no elfnsafty.

Look at period pics and you'll see great bare patches where the riders kit has rubbed the tank bare.

Speaking from my own experience when riding a rigid frame bike over rough ground you'll not be in the saddle long enough to grip the tank. You'll be too busy hanging on to the bars.
Part of the art of riding a rigid bike is to "ride in the stirrups" lift the weight off your backside and allow the bike to pivot around your insteps.

It is far more comfortable than just sitting there hammering your spine.

Its something I do even on made up roads over a pothole, of which we have lots in the west country, and why I look at suffering Bobber riders with wicked glee.

email (option): deadsheds@yahoo.com

Ken's quite right about the use of the kneegrips. The only time that I find myself gripping mine on the Norton is at 'high' speed and this might be related to buttocks clenching involuntarily... They do help keep bike and rider as a whole if caught out by a ridge or irregularity.

My M20 photo references are not as complete as those I have for Norton but do show a fairly clear end to the fitment of kneegrips (but the threaded bosses seem to have been retained).

The latest machine that I can see fitted is C4636149 (WM20 54561) from C11101. I then have a large gap until C4752493 (WM20 71910) - C13290.

In terms of delivery dates, C11101 appears to have commenced in January 1942 and C13290 in November of that year which ties in fairly well with the fall of Singapore in February 1942.

Spare parts lists seem to have been typeset or indeed printed prior to production and it is quite normal to find that they were a little behind actual production changes. I'd say that rubbers were possible up to and including C12424 but unlikely after WM20 71818 (C4752401).

I will do some digging in the Ministry of Supply ledgers to see if they make reference to a cost saving when rubbers were deleted.

Hi Rik
Any chance of a copy of the photo of the M20 C4636149 (WM20 54561) from C11101 please. That bike is only 6 away from mine and according to the factory ledger came out of the factory on 16 Feb 1942. Mine is WM20 54567 and has matching frame and engine numbers and the contract plate still fitted, it came out of the factory on 13 Feb 1942. With very careful wet and dry sanding I found the C No C 4636155 on both sides of the tank, NZ Army vehicle No NZ 16097 on both sides of the front mudguard and yellow square with white 22 on the right side of the tank and a yellow hollow triangle on the oil tank. There was some undecipherable white writing on the left of the tank under the C number and also inside the yellow diamond on the oil tank.
My kneepad plates and mounting screws look original (matching paint) rubber pads long gone though.
Cheers
Doug W

email (option): watsond@xnet.co.nz

Doug, it's an IWM image (NA 8903) that looks to show a DR from the British 5th Division (who did fight alongside the New Zealanders in Italy).

I have the bike listed as C4636149 but looking at the larger image now available, I wonder if it is C4638149 ? Sorry if I raised your hopes unreasonably. I still think on the balance of things that it looks like a '6'. It does confirm that yours was within the knee grips period.

http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205204422

Thanks Rik
I think it is a 6 as the 8 would be curved in more down the back. The photo shows good detail - it has a clip fitted to hold the speedo cable to the fork which is still on my bike and looks like another holding the front brake cable.
Thanks again
Doug W

email (option): watsond@xnet.co.nz

Hi, I think it is an 8, not 6...

After some play with magnify, contrast and brigtness,
It appears that the left side of the figure is opened,
Like a figure 8 made f 2 circles, and the top is not closed.

6 would be closed there.

My openion, anyway...

Noam.

email (option): noam10@gmail.com