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The crankshaft bearing spacer # 66-660
fitted to B & M series engines.
I have noticed a few of these with a lot of wear on the ends after considerable service.
If I was to make one, should I use a high carbon steel, or just plain mild??
Thanks Keith
email (option): keithatkinson@hotmail.com
hi keith,the spacer is supposed to rotate with the crankshaft
and the two bearing inners,so if you see a churned up one the bearings have locked at some time causing one or other inner race to spin on the crank.
if you make your own ,it will take the same time for either material ,so use what you have to hand.
cheers rick
email (option): richardholt@rocketmail.com
Hi Kieth..The original bearing spacer was not hardened but there would be no harm in doing so to make it more durable...I have thought of doing it myself. You will have to use a piece of silver steel and flame harden it after making it.
The spacer should measure 1.000"-1.005" long.
It is common to find wear on this spacer, even in engines that are running well and don't have bearing problems.
The spacer is locked between the bearing by the pressure of the engine shock absorber spring.
I think that over a period of time as the shock absorber operates there is a degree of 'fretting' between the parts as the spring pressure fluctuates, causing the wear......Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Also perfect time to check your chain alignment (its very common to find its out of line due to clutch centre "taper position" varitions sometimes as much as 4mm).
Clutch centres are found to vary in where they sit in the mainshaft.
often shimming out that spacer is needed to get it correct & as you are making a new spacer you have a fantastic opportunity to set your drive alignment up perfectly, there is enough leaway in the set up to let you add a mil or two in length to the spacer (even if 4mm is needed) the added bonus is a bit of extra preload on the spring which has often weakened with age.
A quick check of your drive sprocket will show which side is getting worn & a good clue to misalignment, its very common.
The most common reason for spacers wearing is the locking nut being nowhere near tight enough & people leaving out the locking washer.
Very few people even think of checking the alignment & it is hugely beneficial if it's spot on.
Fred,
Very well said.
Jeff
email (option): jjbandoo@aol.com
after writing it i realised there's no extra preload on the spring when the entire mechanism is moved the "nut to sprocket distance" remains the same
But that wasn't the main aim anyway ....
Am I confused here?
The spacer 66-660 is the one between the drive side bearings innit? So it has no effect on the clutch to engine sprocket alignment, or does it?
The other spacers outboard of the bearings and under the sprocket/shock assembly are different and do influence the alignment and it might be worth making up your own to ensure 100% alignment.
Just a thought though on the original post. How much spare time do you have? A new 66-660 costs 4 quid, surely the time spent making one would be better spent down the pub.
Cheers
Pete
email (option): petercomley@web.de
I never fit the tabwasher to the shock absorber nut. I tighten the nut all the way until it comes up against the end of the cush drive sleeve and then knock it up tight.I haven't had any problems with it loosening...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Yes, i should stay off forums after the pub, i saw reference to the shock spring & thought the outer spacer was being discussed OOOOPS apologies!
Worth mentioning though Fred..
...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
I managed to scrounge a large pin from the company scrap bin
Thought it was hard, but its only mild. I would have liked to use something a bit harder than used in the standard part. never mind.
The OD of the roller bearing inner, excluding the champher, is about an inch and a half.
The OD of the ball bearing inner is approx 1.320", and the original spacer OD is about 1.310"
The height or thickness of the outer and inner bearing rings can vary a bit, depending on the brand.
I'll cut a spacer to about 1.320" OD, that should do it, but not after the pub though.
The excess I can use to make an outer spacer, and get the sprocket alignment correct in the process.
email (option): keithatkinson@hotmail.com
why don't you fit an original one?
Henk
email (option): ahum@quicknet.nl
Because the original ones that I have are worn Henk.
email (option): keithatkinson@hotmail.com
Hi Kieth..When you make the replacements note that the I.D. of the inner and outer spacers aren't the same..so don't bore the inside to the bigger size all the way through!...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Inner and outer spacer
I only see one, 66-660 plus a shim 66-661 (by the way, what thickness?)
Now I will pass a sleepless night
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
email (option): ahum@quicknet.nl
Hi Hans..There is one spacer inside the crankcases between the main bearings..and one on the outside between the outer main bearing and the engine sprocket carrier..I blame Fred for the confusion..
...Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Not seen him for a while
I seem to remember someone saying that shimming the bearing spacer isn't a good idea as there can be some relative movement between the parts (see how the originals get battered) and any shims may break up and go walkies around the bearings. Or am I wrong.. again??
Cheers
Pete
email (option): petercomley@web.de
...Ian
[/quote]
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
Gents
Yesterday my gearbox & entire primary side was removed, first time in approx 30years
Behind the inner cover I found a felt type packing in the crankcase immediately surrounding the bearing carrier on the crankcase, there are 3 deep cavities separated by reinforcing ribs
Is this normal to find ?
Must also check for this spacer located behind the Cush drive assy
Any ideas on the felt ? Prt no availability etc
Many thanks
Job
email (option): Jonnyob1@googlemail.com
Hi Hans..There are two types of 'carriers' for the engine sprocket when used with the '4 lobe' shock absorber assembly..One is a 'one piece' part and has the spacer machined onto the back (and therefore it is hardened) and the other type is used with a seperate spacer. The exploded drawing you have posted shows the one piece arrangement and the shoulder (or spacer) on the back of the sprocket carrier can be seen..but not as a sperate part....Ian
email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com
Aaahh, that's the thing! I have that kind of sprocket. Is it year-specific?
Thanks,
Hans
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
[/quote]Yrs Hans
These were filled with a felt material
Have you seen this before ?
Jo'b
email (option): Jonnyob1@googlemail.com
No John, never seen that in my WDM20, those cavities were empty. Have only seen that when I was young, and playing with my toy cars on a carpet, they finished full of felt-like stuff in the gears
But perhaps Ian knows more
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
hi keith,how are you getting on with your spacers?did you check your bearings for obvious signs of damage ?is there any wear or
scuffing on your crankshaft journals?.
if you use a bit of carbon steel for your bush,you can heat it to a dull red and oil quench to toughen it up.
i cant myself see why if everything is locked up why the spacer became churned up in the first place.anyway let us know how you get on.
cheers rick
email (option): richardholt@rocketmail.com
There is no evidence of the spacer scuffing on the shaft. Just a groove worn into the ends, where the spacer was trying to follow the contoured shape of the bearing inner. (chamfer) Does that make sense???
I think Ian is correct in saying that the ends get fretted over time, from the action of the lobes on the cush drive mechanism, and the pre-load of the spring. ect.
Anyway,
I made 2 spacers out of a mild steel pin.
The ID is 0.985"
The OD is 1.324"
and the width is 1.005"
The diameter of the crankshaft on the drive side is 0.984"
I cut them without removing the piece from the chuck, so that all the surfaces are dead true.
They slide on with just the slightest amount of play.
I'm happy with that. Job done!!!
Unfortunately I can't harden them, as they are mild steel.
I guess I'll have to wait for the next rebuild, to see how they stand-up.
As Ian pointed out, these spacers were not hardened when they came out of the factory.
Keith
email (option): keithatkinson@hotmail.com
email (option): viaconsu # planet dot nl
Thanks for the tip about the Kasenit powder.
I'll investigate that for sure. It must cyanide based product.
Keith
email (option): keithatkinson@hotmail.com