Here's the address of a new e-petition. MAG member Jon Wilmer (Regional Rep for Thames Valley) has launched this. The petition is live for 3 months, but don't wait. If you can pass this on to other forums, friends, etc, please do.

From 1st Jan 2013, high visibility "Dayglo" jackets for motorcyclists will become law in France, but only for riders of machines over 125cc.

It will become law in Ireland in 2014.

https://submissions.epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/26931

What it will mean is that your days of wearing full dress despatch rider gear in France will effectively be over. You might, of course get away with it. But the penalty is very high if you get the wrong copper on your case.

There's a piece on my website about this. Or just Google and see what others are saying.

http://www.sumpmagazine.com/classicbikenews/index.htm

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

What is this damn obsession with all-things hi-vis?
I even went to a car storage site the other week and the guy on the gate had to check that I had a hi-vis in the van before he'd even let me in.....!

And no hi-vis for 125cc and under? Thinking back, I was probably at my most dangerous on a bike when on a 50cc or 125cc.

Will there be 200 riders at the 70th anniversary in hi-vis clothing?

email (option): lee@twowheelstested.co.uk

It's horrendous, isn't it ? I've signed the petition but doubt that it'll carry much weight.

I'm not sure that I want to carry on motorcycling if I have to dress like a Christmas tree (and I've worn high-vis on wet motorways for twenty-five years).

Is this because I'm a 'poseur' and not a serious motorcyclist anymore ?

Belgium threw out a suggestion of this at the end of last year.

In my opinion, it's part of a campaign to make motorcycling seem less 'cool' and attractive. It's a shame because many parts of France seem to have large numbers of motorcyclists using their bikes on an everyday basis.

This creates a real and unwelcome dilemma which I think will take me some time to resolve.
I am absolutely against this law on the basis of long held principles...I have always stated that I refuse to accept a motorcycle and rider are any more difficult to see than all the rest of the objects that surround us in the world, and that no artificial aids are needed to highlight their presence on the road. Use of the eyesight they were born with and a reasonable degree of concentration are all that is required from other road users/ pedestrians etc. to miraculously make a motorcycle and its rider completely visible.
Wearing Hi Viz clothing is, in my opinion, an admission that you are prepared to accept the concept that you are difficult to see...which I do not.
On that basis I am genuinely unsure whether I am prepared to wear the stuff..even to enable me to partake in something I enjoy..In life the only thing you really have are your principles..and I usually live by mine...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Maybe they should force hi-viz paintjobs on all cars? This should help us stop driving into cars that pull out on us!

email (option): davmax@ntlworld.com

OK, so if a 90mm piston makes an M20 720cc, what size piston makes an M20 124cc

Looks like the Welbike will be OK in France though Rob.

email (option): robmiller11@yahoo.co.uk

It's just another underhanded way of dissuading us from riding. And it will work too, because that will be the end for me!

You guys are taking this news very well. I expected my computer to explode with hundreds of posts threatening a new British Expeditionary Force. But so far, it's business as usual.

It's no good telling each other that we object. That's how all these daft laws take root. You have to tell the RIGHT people in the RIGHT way and at the RIGHT time. Maybe there's nothing that can be done, but you can guarantee that by simply doing nothing.

Here's a draft letter for anyone to copy and fill in the appropriate blanks. Beneath the letter is an address for a website that will allow you to find the email address of your MP. Anyone outside the UK can write to whoever they feel is appropriate (and adjust the draft letter where necessary).

Please send that email. The responses should prove interesting. You might try forwarding the responses to the Motorcycle Action Group.

Dear ??????

Can I draw your attention to a new law to be introduced by France on 1st January 2013?

Specifically, riders of motorcycles above 125cc will be compelled to wear “Dayglo” high visibility clothing of at least 150cm2 on the upper torso.

This law will require not only compliance by French motorcyclists, but compliance by visiting riders. The penalty for failure to wear such a vest is €68.

Many riders feel this law is irrational and unfairly discriminatory.

Please note that:

Cyclists are exempt from the law.
Pedestrians are exempt.
Riders of sub-125cc capacity machines are exempt.
Only riders of larger bikes are being targeted.

Whilst some might view objection to this law as trivial, it actually infringes and restricts otherwise lawful motorcycle activity in numerous ways. Moreover, the “right” to dress how one chooses is surely a basic human right, and should not be denied simply because one is riding a larger capacity motorcycle, or indeed any capacity motorcycle.

This is a fundamental freedom of choice issue. There would be outrage were pedestrians also compelled to wear reflective clothing in an effort to improve road safety.

I understand that this is a French law, but as a motorcyclist it impinges on my free, unfettered movement throughout Europe.

French riders are already compelled to ride with lights on at all times, and wear reflective strips on their crash helmets.

Please can you give me your views on this “Dayglo” law?

Yours ??????
Address details ?????

http://findyourmp.parliament.uk

You might want to check that I've haven't made a clumsy and "obvious" mistake here before sending that email.

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

I signed the petition!

email (option): davmax@ntlworld.com

Sounds like the Beetles song "Tax Man". Next thing ya know, they'll make you capture your farts for fuel.

email (option): britool51@hotmail.com

Good on you, Dave. The petition is one thing. Now email your MP. Details above.

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

Signed it, it's all getting to ridiculous for words

email (option): horror@blueyonder.co.uk

I've signed it as well..and would urge others to do the same...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Hi Rob...A 41mm piston will give you 124cc in an M20..but as you have an M21 crank you will be needing an 11.9mm one to scrape under the limit...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

As a disenfranchised ex-pat, I've just spent twenty minutes going round EU websites in the hope that I could find a contact point. At least I now know where failed Belgian politicians end up, but not much more !

Is there any sign of someone in the know taking this up with the French ? What are French riders organisations doing ? Any links to some French sources ?

These stupid laws happen because we LET them happen. It's as simple as that. Whinge all you like, but whingeing to each other doesn't do anything except make us feel a little better.

I've put details on an earlier post about how to contact your MP. There's a draft email too. Write the bloody email. Send it. Don't sit there apathetically and treat this as a fait accompli. Challenge the legitimacy of this law. Resist. WRITE THAT EMAIL!!!!

If you're in Europe find someone in your own country to contact. MP. MEP. President. Prime Minister.

Note to Rik: The Federation of European Motorcyclists should be all over this one. Check their website for the latest.

glosborn@tiscali.co.uk

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

Thanks for the link Danny.

FFMC are now saying that they've got it down to an armband - still bloody silly though.

http://www.fema-online.eu/index.php?mact=News,cntnt01,detail,0&cntnt01articleid=275&cntnt01returnid=15

It seems that if the government isn't re-elected, it might not happen but there is talk of a big demo on 24th march.

Maybe a Blue and White DR arm band will do

email (option): horror@blueyonder.co.uk

Hi Rik, I've seen the FEMA report, but I've also got other reports that the armbands are being considered, but have not been agreed by the French government. In the interim, I suggest that people continue to sign the petition and alert their MPs of the potential danger.

Often these things are overblown. But sometimes the danger is very real and imminent. I'll keep monitoring this. I wonder how many guys on this forum like the idea of riding around in despatch rider battledress with reflective bibs/armbands/strips on the crash helmets, etc.

The issue is by no means settled.

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

I've signed the petition also, and I'll be looking at contacting my MP later today with a suitably modified version of Danny's letter. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Letter sent to MP too!

email (option): davmax@ntlworld.com

I copied and pasted a modified version of Danny's letter and sent it to the four MEP's for my area and also to my local MP. It was dead easy once I got going. I might even start on the Lords next. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

The New Zealand bureaucrats in charge of making life boring have recently invited submissions from consultants, brief is to investigate the merits of hi vis for motorcyclists.
Why is it the stupidist ideas which spread most quickly.

It's quite possible that this issue won't be a big problem for 'us'.
An official historic event, like in Normandy every year, has been 'licensed' for overruling the 'normal' law regulations.
You must be careful if you take your WD bike for a occasional ride on the french roads dressed like a DR if this law is being activated...

email (option): snvosselman@hotmail.com

Normandy is a problem...It is all very well to say it has official sanction to ignore the regulations (as a historical event) but in organising such an event you have to realise it is the nature of French Beaurocracy that you need to have an 'official sanction' in your hand to present to any member of the Gendarmerie that takes an interest.
Whilst it is possible to contact the Local Gendarmerie in the D Day area to seek written confirmation of such a sanction..which may or may not be granted and may or may not be limited in its nature...that is not the case with the National Gendarmerie and the CRS..who will all be operating in the area at the time of a big anniversary like the 70th. Personally I wouldn't recommend labouring the finer points of the law with a member of the CRS without some documentation to back up your words.
Previously I have never heard of any form of official sanction for the period around D Day...though we have never had any problems so it may be in force.
On the 65th. we had written confirmation of our
invitation to Arromanches for the main commemorations in the town from the Mayors office...and I am currently in the process of getting that again for the 70th.
Without this type of confirmation you can turn up anywhere and be stopped in your tracks by the first local Gendarme you meet...with no arguements or discussions.
With regard to FEMA I admire them for being right on the case with major protests planned for March. MAG should take a lesson from them. The last MAG protest with 40,000 motorcyclists in relatively small groups around the country barely made the news. They should be planning one major protest in London..
As for Hi Viz...a 'downgrading' to the level of wearing an armband, should that happen, I could probably live with..under duress. Hopefully the protests and a change of Government in France may see the legislation shelved..I live in hope..Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Here Here!
Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

i have signed it though i am not fully against wearing one i have one with caution (in red)my rear vision is limted.This is due to the fact that if you handle bars are not in the straight ahead position your mirror will be looking else where Rik had a good idea we could put a tube of flashing chrismas lights sewn on the back of the jacket plus bells whistles we in england will not be wearing them because we are very strict on the human rights so it will be everybody will have to wear them pedestrians/surgens in an operating theatre and so on or none at all

Don't forget it was you pommies who started all this health & safety bullshit years ago. Just look back 10 years ago and every second rider at rallies meetings etc was wearing Hi- Vis. This gave every politician on earth this wonderful idea. It's filtered down here at every worksite. Even picking grapes out on a vineyard they have to wear them in case the pig flying overhead lands on top of you!

Lets all remember the French have banned Muslim Raghead women from wearing the full face veil,so if they are willing to take on Islam,a few old bikers will be no problem,lets face it,if we get out of the EU,I think all of us will be better off,and as a bonus would not have all that "Health and Safety"shit to put up with either,that also goes for this "Human Rights"crap that is causing lots of problems,what wee need to do is get out of the EU.Then all these problems would vanish,simple's.

email (option): glesgaman@tiscali.co.uk

I put Danny's letter to my local MP who seemed to get back to me rather too quickly to have spent any time on the matter, here is his reply
Dear Mr Plumb,



Many thanks for your e-mail. Notwithstanding that this is a French law over which I have no influence at all, I would think, as you suggest, they have taken the decision to ask motorcyclists of larger vehicles to wear high visibility clothing in order to improve road safety. I have not seen the evidence base for this decision, but I would hesitate before criticising a relatively low impact move which will save lives. I agree with you however that any new rule should be brought in on a consistent basis.
I thought the answer a little too brief, so I wrote back with this explaining my views and now I await his reply.

Dear Mr Field.
I see you have not seen the main reason for my objection, to be forced in the present economic climate (if the bill is passed) to purchase a high visibility jacket which apparently, will be a full sleeved type. No doubt the correct BS approved type has yet to be decided, but no doubt it will add extra bulk to the already bulky safety gear that all responsible motorcyclists wear. This would in summer be a big inconvenience and possibly hinder the safe operation of the motorcycle and the only option would be to incorporate the safety aspect into the jacket (such as body armour back protection etc) which would not be a cheap option.
Most motorcyclists do spend a lot of money on their protective clothing and most of them I have spoken to would be reluctant to be forced to wear such a type. I myself would not want to wear one, although some of the others I have spoken to already wear one when they choose to, but would be unhappy about being forced to wear it all the time for the above mentioned reasons.
I believe that you think that it would be a good idea on the grounds of road safety, but if you take the time to investigate the matter fully, you will see that riders of motorcycles and scooters below 125cc would be exempt from wearing one, surely most riders of motorcycles under 125cc are learner drivers and are more likely to put themselves in danger? I also note that cyclists are not to be forced to wear one of them either, surely, as cyclists tend to have poorer lighting on their bikes I would have deemed that these would be a neccessity for them?
I see the exemption for cyclists is probably based on the fact that a bicycle is a pedestrian controlled vehicle and therefore it would be an infringement of their civil liberties to force the issue on them.
There have been studies into high visibility jackets, which basically said that if everyone wore one, it would lose it's impact as a high visibility item of clothing. Other studies have shown that by putting contrasting colours together it becomes hard to decide an object's speed, size and direction of travel, an idea put into practice on world war one battleships, it was known as dazzle camoflague.
In summary I don't believe that enforcing the issue would really have any effect on road safety and surely the effort would be better placed on making every road user more aware of other road users as surely on a dark night, a headlamp would stand out a lot more than a jacket! Most of the larger motorcyles already have the headlight connecting to the ignition, meaning that the lights are on all the time. All in all I see it as "a solution looking for a problem" and also an infringement of my freedom of choice.
I myself will be involved in any protests (which are already being planned if it becomes law) and as my MP, I would like your support on the matter, ensuring that the bill would be passed on sound information and careful research and not just an "insignificant law" that would be passed as it seems "like a sensible idea for road safety"
Yours
Dave Plumb




































With best wishes,

Frank

email (option): davmax@ntlworld.com

Hi Dave, well done for that. It's not clear yet exactly what form this reflective gear would take, or if it will be abandoned. But that's no reason not to get on top of this at the outset.

I emailed my MP and ended up having an online argument with him. His response was similar to yours; he's not a French MP, so it's not his concern.

I did point out that this was still a discriminatory issue targeted at UK citizens too (in the form of tourism). I reminded him that he's still got an obligation to his constituents to be aware of issues affecting them. I also mentioned that any such move would be resisted here. I'm not sure what I achieved, except to raise general awareness of biking issues - which is always a good thing.

There's never any guarantee of support when lobbying MPs, but every once in a while you get lucky and find a new friend. It's worth the effort.

email (option): dannydefazio@sumpmagazine.com

I have also e mailed a letter to my MP, who I have met previously regarding another matter .The fact is that we are in the 'European Project' and events that affect UK citizens when they travel within Europe should be of interest to our MPs.
It is the nature of 'Europe' that legislation introduced by one country has a distinct tendency to be either adopted voluntarily by other countries or is turned into Europe wide law by the European parliament.
So, whilst at this stage there is no direct benefit in contacting your MP it may be an 'investement in the future' to make them aware of what is going on and the fact you don't like it.
If nothing else at this stage it may make them consider their own position on the matter.
I asked my MP directly what his stance would be should this legislation be considered for adoption in the UK..We'll see what his answer is.
I think it quite likely in most cases the answer will initally be generalised and contain the usual bland commemts and assumptions...If that is the response I get I'll be writing a second letter as Dave did...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Henk might appreciate this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAnGYfnFz9I

Maybe in any letters that we send to MP's we should quote website addresses and forum threads so show the sentiment and strength of feeling on this matter, I can't help feeling that my reply was written to appease "just one crank" who was whinging about it, let them see that there is a great number of people out there that won't sign any petition or write to their MP but still are very unhappy about it enough to write on a forum blog or whatever but feel that the government will ride roughshod over them even if they did sign them
Does anyone know what the euro to sterling exchange rate was when they decided the fine was 68 euro? It sounds a bit of a suspect number for a fine for failure to comply, did it equate to exactly £60 (our standard fixed penalty fine)when it was decided? If so, was it made with our fixed penalty in mind?

email (option): davmax@ntlworld.com

Hmmmmm..... quite an emotive subject!
I have to say that I've been wearing a reflective bib for years now, not because I have to, but because I put a value on my miserable little life! Bear in mind that in Europe, you're dealing with an educated driver who obeys the rules (generally!), while down here in DDA we are on the roads with a driver culture that dictates that he who has the biggest vehicle has right of way. The percentage of drivers with forged licences or even without licences is staggering. Road laws are taken with a pinch of salt, red traffic lights are ignored with gay abandon and pissed drivers are common.
I need to make sure that I do everything possible to be as visible as possible to these clowns, and a high viz jacket works amazingly well! We all know from personal experience that on the road one picks out the reflective jacket long before a black leather jacket.
But having said that, it's a personal preference and the choice is mine, entirely. As it should be unless you're being a danger to others.
Here in South Africa a headlight has to be switched on if a machine was manufactured in 1960 or later. The Veteran and Vintage Association (SAVVA) successfully lobbied the powers that be for exclusion prior to this - although most traffic policemen are oblivious to the fact. I carry a copy of the legislation in my wallet.....
I can well appreciate the concern of the folk that are riding in re-enactment scenarios not wanting to look like canaries - sort of ruins the mood a bit! Not a lot of dressing up down here though.... not a lot of military bikes on the road either for that matter....
But you know what? Once the Department of Transport - or whatever they call themselves over there - decide to push something through as legislation, precedent dictates that there is very little Joe Public can do about it.....

why do workers wear hard hats and hi vis when working on a roof

We have already had the MAG protest about this and other legislation. Although in my opinion the protest was fairly inneffective because it was not concentrated in one place but dispersed across the country it did bring out 40,000 or so protestors..and the fact it happened can be easily verified by an MP.
Perhaps that fact should be mentioned in letters to MPs..that 40,000 people have already protested..It might dispel the idea that your are a 'cranky individual'...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com