Welcome to the Artists Poll!

To complete the trifecta of polls, we will now undertake a poll of AM's most beloved artists. Still fuming over one of your favorite artist's early exit from Survivor? Wishing an artist was eligible, but is not recognized in the top 100 or 200 on the site? This is the place to make your voice heard! The goal is to make an authoritative list of this very website's most revered artists, so I encourage anyone and everyone to participate, even if you don't regularly post here! The first 100 artists on your ballot will awarded points according to a yet-to-be-determined formula. I hope the fact that the formula has yet to be finalized does not deter voters. My hope is that we can reach a consensus about the appropriate formula within the next week so that those whose ballots will be influenced by the formula in question know exactly how their ballots will affect the outcome. Unranked lists are OK too, so long as they don't exceed 100 artists. Thus, if you don't have the time or energy to determine who is number 79 and who is number 80, feel free to submit your list. We will determine an appropriate scoring system for ballots of this type as well.

Here are some guidelines for your submission:

Please include performers only in your ballot. This will lead to a clearer interpretation of the result. Another list of AM's favorite producers, arrangers, writers, etc. may be an interesting adventure, but my opinion is that a list of only performers will suit us well, given the nature of the previous polls and the Artist Survivor game. However, I am open to suggestions. If there is sufficient demand for the inclusion of sidemen, we can go with that. This is your list, after all.

Just what constitutes a singular artist is often a hazy designation. Should Gary Numan and Tubeway Army be separate entities? How about Parliament and Funkadelic? Nickelback, Creed, The Calling and Hinder? (Just kidding). To avoid confusion, I believe the best strategy is to use the definitions of artists here on AM. If you're unsure, check the "Artist Lists" on the main site page for clarity. Thus, Gary Numan and Tubeway Army are to be considered separately, while Parliament/Funkadelic will have to groove together. I think this will solve most of the problems of this nature. Artists that are not featured at all on AM are unlikely to make a big splash in this poll, so borderline cases for such artists should not have a major impact.

So where do you come in?

Please submit your ballot of artists to ian_renner@yahoo.com.

I would prefer you to submit it as a Microsoft Excel document, but if this software is unavailable to you, I'd prefer you to submit your ballot in some type of spreadsheet software. If that is not possible, go ahead and submit, and I'll work around it.

It would help me a great deal if artists whose name begins with "The" are entered in a uniform way. So if you would like to vote for The Cure, please submit it as "Cure, The". This will save me a great deal of time.

As usual, your comments about your selected artists are always welcome. They add a great deal of personal flavor to the final list when it is presented. Of course, this step is not necessary, but for those of you who wish to expound upon your love of certain artists, this is your chance to shine.

I know that it's a hard ask to rank artists. Picking albums and songs is a bit easier, as they stand alone. However, what exactly makes us prefer one artist to another is much more difficult to define. Henrik's formula for ranking artists based on their positions in the song and album rankings is a good start, but there are certainly other factors. What about live performance? Consistency? Influence? Ability as a male to pull off high heels and makeup at 5'2" and still kick ass?

Because of this, I'd like to keep the voting lines open until August 15th. This gives you a month and a half to come up with your list, and I don't think anything else is on the AM calendar for mid-August, so it shouldn't take the limelight away from other deserving lists like the results of the Artist Survivor of the Bottom 100 Songs poll.

Let the lists begin!

Does the list have to be limited to artists that are featured on AM or the list is completely free ?
I hope the list is free because many of my favourite artists are not acclaimed (the world isn't perfect ).

I don't agree you Moonbeam, I personally think that an artists list is much easier to make than a list of albums or songs.

I'll answer that one for Moonbeam, as I'm 100% sure of the answer: you're completely free to choose any artist you like. Except for 50 Cent.

... and Radiohead (joke)

Thank you Stephan. My list will be with no 50 Cent guaranteed ! I wouldn't give a simple penny for the crappy shit he make.
I'm already excited to make my list and to give justice to the artists I love without any albums/songs ranking contraint.

Stephan is right, Dumbangel- there is no restriction about the artists to be included, as long as they are performers! Strangely enough, Chump Change is actually one of the top 500 AM artists! Disgusting as that is, I think (and hope) he'll finish much lower on our list!

Argh! So many polls! We should save these for the winter months, when we're all holed up inside using our computers anyway.

But I'm sure in your case Moonbeam, living in the Australian paradise like you are (does it ever get cold down there?), it's not really an issue.

a month and a half is plenty of time, though.

Where does all this hate for 50 Cent come from? He's no personal favorite of mine, but there certainly are worse artists out there.

Rune, if I made a bottom 100 artist list, 50 Cent would rank (and I do mean rank) near the bottom 10!

I don't know where I'd rank him, but to me he represents everything that's wrong with rap.

Just one nitpicky question.

Can you include bands, and members of that band solo? Like Beatles *and* John Lennon?

Definitely, BillAdama!

Although I think the only one I ended up including was both Neil Young and Buffalo Springfield.

I think the only one one I ended up including was both Justin Timberlake and N'Sync

I really think he did his best work with N*Sync, so I'm not including him as a solo act.

Should I separate Jefferson Airplane and Jefferson Starship?

And in comes the first ballot! We're off!

I'm doing combination of my song poll, my artist poll, my charts on lastmusic (a little biased since there are some artists who I listen mostly on transports)... It starts to look good, but anyway I will make a few correction by hands to punish albums I hate or to promote versatily (since I only use 3 albums and 3 songs to make my calculation)... or just to follow my heart...
But it makes a really decent starting list, and it helps me kill lot of time at work !

I wanted to edit the list a little bit and maybe move Pulp in there.. but I don't know where to place them and I doubt the changes will make much of a difference, so I've just sent you my list.

Maybe I'll add, collectively, the 50 or so Berklee graduates living in Nashville who wrote all of N Sync's songs.

Or maybe I'll add their voice modifier. Because that's what's really doing the singing.

So a producer/sideman needs to at least have a single or album released under his name to be eligible? I think if everyone voted for whatever name, it won't get in the way of the 100 results that much, especially since Moonbeam has accepted The Beatles & John Lennon as separate artists. So there won't be any confusion for him when he sees Soft Machine & Robert Wyatt, or Velvet Underground/Lou Reed. There should be less confusion if someone picks Phil Spector. If Parliament & Funkadelic can be counted together, why keep out great sources of music just because they gave their work to different names without ever releasing anything under their own.
There will only be a few that have a chance at the top 100 anyway, so why keep them out is what I'm mainly trying to say.

Hi Georgie-

The main reasons I thought it might be better to restrict the list to performers only are mainly for consistency with the website and the Survivor game and consistency of the results. I imagine that a lot of people would impose these same restrictions on their individual lists anyway, resulting in important sidemen underperforming in the final list.

We don't have to submit 100, right? It would be fine if I submitted 50?

Either way, this list will probably be copy and pasted from my last.fm and rearranged a little (if I manage to participate at all).

Sure, Penguin! 50 artists in your submission is fine.

So Moonbeam - if I have Prince listed at, say, #10 on my list... can I bump him down to #20 or so to make room for Yellowcard, All-American Rejects, t.A.T.u. and other, more deserving acts?

Most definitely, Anthony! It doesn't mean I won't rig the votes, though.

By the way, I'm impressed with your correct capitalization of t.A.T.u.!

Well, any self-respecting t.A.T.u fan should know how to spell their name.

(Just joking of course. Christopher Tracy isn't going anywhere.)

Three lists have been submitted so far! Keep 'em coming! I really think we need to decide on a formula soon. Some things to consider:

-There will be a lot more overlap with the artists list than in the albums and songs lists.

-I want to accommodate different list sizes, as I've already received one list that doesn't include 100 artists. So no Pazz 'n Jop type of point system.

-Here are the results of 3 formulas that have been proposed, the 2nd of which is Henrik's suggestion:

Pos F1 F2 F3
1 100.00 100.00 100.00
2 75.79 84.86 85.69
3 64.44 77.87 74.95
4 57.43 73.50 66.60
5 52.53 70.36 59.91
6 48.84 67.91 54.44
7 45.92 65.90 49.87
8 43.53 64.18 46.01
9 41.52 62.67 42.70
10 39.81 61.31 39.82
11 38.32 60.08 37.31
12 37.01 58.93 35.09
13 35.84 57.87 33.11
14 34.80 56.86 31.34
15 33.85 55.91 29.75
16 32.99 55.00 28.30
17 32.20 54.13 26.99
18 31.47 53.29 25.79
19 30.80 52.47 24.69
20 30.17 51.68 23.67
21 29.59 50.91 22.73
22 29.04 50.16 21.86
23 28.53 49.43 21.06
24 28.05 48.71 20.30
25 27.59 48.00 19.60
26 27.17 47.31 18.94
27 26.76 46.62 18.32
28 26.37 45.95 17.74
29 26.00 45.28 17.19
30 25.65 44.63 16.67
31 25.32 43.98 16.18
32 25.00 43.34 15.71
33 24.69 42.70 15.27
34 24.40 42.07 14.85
35 24.12 41.45 14.45
36 23.85 40.83 14.07
37 23.59 40.22 13.71
38 23.34 39.61 13.36
39 23.10 39.01 13.03
40 22.87 38.41 12.71
41 22.64 37.81 12.41
42 22.42 37.22 12.12
43 22.21 36.62 11.84
44 22.01 36.04 11.57
45 21.81 35.45 11.31
46 21.62 34.87 11.06
47 21.44 34.29 10.82
48 21.26 33.72 10.58
49 21.08 33.14 10.36
50 20.91 32.57 10.14
51 20.75 32.00 9.93
52 20.59 31.43 9.73
53 20.43 30.87 9.53
54 20.28 30.30 9.34
55 20.13 29.74 9.16
56 19.99 29.18 8.98
57 19.84 28.62 8.81
58 19.71 28.07 8.64
59 19.57 27.51 8.48
60 19.44 26.95 8.32
61 19.31 26.40 8.16
62 19.19 25.85 8.01
63 19.07 25.30 7.86
64 18.95 24.75 7.72
65 18.83 24.20 7.58
66 18.71 23.65 7.45
67 18.60 23.11 7.31
68 18.49 22.56 7.19
69 18.38 22.02 7.06
70 18.28 21.48 6.94
71 18.18 20.93 6.82
72 18.07 20.39 6.70
73 17.98 19.85 6.58
74 17.88 19.31 6.47
75 17.78 18.77 6.36
76 17.69 18.24 6.25
77 17.60 17.70 6.15
78 17.51 17.16 6.04
79 17.42 16.63 5.94
80 17.33 16.09 5.84
81 17.24 15.56 5.74
82 17.16 15.02 5.65
83 17.08 14.49 5.55
84 16.99 13.96 5.46
85 16.91 13.42 5.37
86 16.83 12.89 5.28
87 16.76 12.36 5.20
88 16.68 11.83 5.11
89 16.61 11.30 5.02
90 16.53 10.77 4.94
91 16.46 10.24 4.86
92 16.39 9.71 4.78
93 16.32 9.18 4.70
94 16.25 8.66 4.62
95 16.18 8.13 4.55
96 16.11 7.60 4.47
97 16.04 7.08 4.40
98 15.98 6.55 4.32
99 15.91 6.03 4.25
100 15.85 5.50 4.18

#3 for sure. The lower artist #100 is, the better.

What's good about number 3 is that it really separates the lower rankings. With formula 3, an artist needs 10 votes at position 50 to overtake 1 vote at position 1. I just wonder if it's a little too harsh.

No, because 3 votes at #50 overtake 1 vote at #10. Sure, a #1 vote is very valuable but if you try to compensate for that it comes at the expense of the 10-20 range. 3 votes at #50 seems about the right balance to overtake one #10.

Oops I meant 4 votes. Which is the right balance I was talking about.

Here's a not so hypothetical example. I've received 3 lists so far. In each case, which artist do you believe should be ranked higher?

Case 1:

Artist A rankings: 1, 3, -
Artist B rankings: 5, 8, 9

Case 2:

Artist C rankings: 6, 42, -
Artist D rankings: 19, 28, 69

Case 3:

Artist E rankings: 7, 18, -
Artist F rankings: 10, 28, 66

Case 1:

***Artist A rankings: 1, 3, -
Artist B rankings: 5, 8, 9

Case 2:

***Artist C rankings: 6, 42, - But this one is close
Artist D rankings: 19, 28, 69

Case 3:

***Artist E rankings: 7, 18, -
Artist F rankings: 10, 28, 66

Then Formula 3 is the one for you! I personally would think that an artist with rankings of 5, 8 and 9 should be an artist with rankings of 1 and 3, but perhaps I'm in the minority here.

I tend to agree with you Moonbeam, I value consistency over a few big scores. I think Henrik's option would be the closest one I would favor though I think it maybe should decrease a little quicker. So for instance it would take two 45's to beat a #10 not two 53's and two 17's to beat a #1 and not two 22's.

If I were designing the formula I'd probably try to use some kind of recurrence relation like...

f(n) = 2f(cn)

So for some constant c, you'd be saying an album ranked n counts for double an album ranked cn. So if c were 4, then album #1 would be worth 100, album #4 would be worth 50, album #16 would be worth 25, etc.

The formula would be f(n) = n^(-log(c)2) * 100. I don't know if that's similar to Henrik's formula. The trick would just be deciding at what multiple you want the points to cut in half.

I've got to side with Moonbeam on these as well. Just the fact that there were three very high votes versus two high votes and a no-show should mean that the one with three votes is better.

I've liking Henrik's formula the best right now, but I'm thinking that there isn't a big enough gap in the middle (artists 10-50) while the gap for the later artists (50-100) seems fine.

Just my two cents.

That first one was close for me too actually and now that I think about it, three top ten votes should be above two top 5. But, there should be a dramatic dropoff somewhere. I made my list last night (still have to write comments) and there is a pretty big difference between even #3 and #4. There's a gigantic difference between #10 and #30.

With artists you have to be looking at an entire catalog. For me there are about 10-15 artists that I have really liked their whole catalog or enough of it to be able to listen to that artists for hours without skipping a song. After that I looked at artists where I really like a couple albums but could do without the rest. Then, the one classic album and then a few are on the list who have a bunch of songs I really love. Those were my tiers and obviously tier one deserves a lot more points than tier two etc... Now, I know that nobody is going to have the same tiers. But, I think there has to be more of a dropoff to represent that. That's why I mentioned letting each voter assign their own points to artists with maximum and minimum caps. That way each voter would be able to assign their own tiers.

But, it's totally up to you!

Okay, I thought about proposing this idea awhile ago, but thought it might be overly complicated. What the hell, there's not a concensus yet. How about we let everyone choose a ranking where the points start to drop more dramatically?

If doing this in Excel, it wouldn't be too difficult, it could be done with an IF statement like this (just an example):

=IF(A3<15,B2*0.99,B2*0.95)

So for items ranked 1-14, the rate of point drop off is much less than for items ranked 15-100.

Then you multiply the output you get by the total number of points allowed per ballot over the sum of all points you get in the equation.

This would be an example in which every ballot is given 100 points (sorry, I don't know enough html to make this formatting pretty):

Band, Rank, Points, Real Points

Mariah Carey, 1, 100, C2 * (100/SUM(C2:C4))
Ace of Base, 2, 99, C3 * (100/SUM(C2:C4))
William Shatner, 3, 94.05, C4 * (100/SUM(C2:C4))

I got the idea from the kinked demand curve represented in an oligopoly since obviously my mind didn't drift in basic microeconomics.

Great discussion, guys! I've made a modified version of formula 3 that isn't so severe. Let me know what you think:

Pos Pts
1 100.00
2 91.58
3 84.45
4 78.33
5 73.02
6 68.36
7 64.25
8 60.60
9 57.32
10 54.36
11 51.68
12 49.25
13 47.01
14 44.97
15 43.08
16 41.33
17 39.71
18 38.20
19 36.79
20 35.48
21 34.24
22 33.08
23 31.99
24 30.95
25 29.98
26 29.05
27 28.18
28 27.34
29 26.55
30 25.79
31 25.07
32 24.38
33 23.72
34 23.09
35 22.48
36 21.90
37 21.34
38 20.81
39 20.29
40 19.79
41 19.31
42 18.84
43 18.39
44 17.95
45 17.53
46 17.13
47 16.73
48 16.35
49 15.97
50 15.61
51 15.26
52 14.92
53 14.58
54 14.26
55 13.94
56 13.63
57 13.33
58 13.04
59 12.75
60 12.47
61 12.20
62 11.93
63 11.67
64 11.41
65 11.16
66 10.91
67 10.67
68 10.43
69 10.20
70 9.97
71 9.75
72 9.53
73 9.31
74 9.10
75 8.89
76 8.68
77 8.48
78 8.28
79 8.08
80 7.89
81 7.70
82 7.51
83 7.32
84 7.14
85 6.96
86 6.78
87 6.60
88 6.42
89 6.25
90 6.08
91 5.91
92 5.74
93 5.58
94 5.42
95 5.25
96 5.09
97 4.93
98 4.78
99 4.62
100 4.46

Can we vote for Paranthropus Boisei?

That looks pretty good!

Boisei is TOTALLY derivative of australopithecus. Lucy would whoop that ass!

Hey, man. Boisei was the first rock band!

Ready for a really corny line?

Boisei was pre-Stone Age!

BillAdama, I like the idea of your formula a lot. However, I haven't found a suitable value for c. What seems to work well for artists in the lower echelon doesn't work so well for artists near the top, and vice versa. For instance, letting c = 4 is a bit harsh on artists near the top. Maybe tweaking it slightly would work?

Slush, your idea is also great, but I think it might deter some potential voters from participating if they have to assign their own point system to score each artist, as cool as that would be!

Maybe a dumb question, but am I supposed to vote for the artists whose music I most enjoy (subjective favorites), or for the artists who I feel have achieved the greatest accomplishments in the world of music (objective importance)?

In my case there's a pretty wide gap between these two lists.

Paul, whatever criteria you want to use for your list is fine- there aren't any rules! I think most people are submitting a list of their favorites, as I will do.

One month remaining for submissions! So far I've received six lists. That's actually not so bad considering how early it is in the game.

As for the formula, I'll take suggestions for the next week or so. If there aren't any, I'll go with the last formula that I posted.

I Don't know if I'll do this - 100 artists seems to many for me...

You don't have to submit 100, Midaso! I've received one list of 50 artists and another of 66.

If it's not too difficult for you, Moonbeam, I would suggest us not just numbering our lists, but also setting them up in tiers like John (kind of) proposed. Then, we could work out a formula like Slush suggested for each list individually.

Actually, it would really just be easier for us to assign points ourselves...

OK - I might try and do 50 then. Beyond that,I'd be getting into artists I like but on the basis of too little of their overall output...

Penguin, at this point, too many people have submitted lists for me to ask them to do it again with a point system that would be difficult to govern.

Last chance to suggest a change of formula! By tomorrow, it will be decided!

A little over a week remains to get in those lists!

Thanks for reminding me!

Hey Moonbeam, just want to make sure you got mine...

I did indeed, sam!

Two more lists received! The list is starting to take shape, and there are some big surprises! There are two artists outside of the AM top 100 that are in the top 20!

I have 4 suspects for those 2 artists (well... just looked at the loophole round of Survivor Island in fact) and one which would really please me (of course !)

You'll get mine by tuesday I guess
(wednesday is vacations, so I probably won't see the results live

Another great thing is that it's still anyone's game at this point in terms of an eventual winner.

Thanks for the reminder, Moonbeam, I really need to hurry up now ...

Well, while everybody else is going to get brainwashed by the biggest Olympic propaganda show since '36 (let's hope I'm totally wrong about that), it should be no problem to keep me focused on music listening.

I guess you are already wrong Andre, 1980 and 1984 have been great year for Olympic propaganda too !

My list will probably come without comments. I'm too busy as of mow to add them, but I'll get it in.

After 10 ballots, there are still a few artists in the AM top 100 that have yet to receive a single vote! Just as there are quite a few surprises in the top 100, there are quite a few surprises NOT in the top 300.

Keep the lists rollin' in!

Yes, everyone forget the soon to be strongest country in the world has a government that thinks natural rights don't exist, micromanages its peoples' lives and stifles all dissension, sports are going on! And there's dancing!

Is Wilco one of the surprises? I don't recall them being top 100.

I just sent my list! :D

And the list grows!

I'm really waiting til the last moment possible, because this list still changes pretty frequently.

Yes, everyone forget the soon to be strongest country in the world has a government that thinks natural rights don't exist, micromanages its peoples' lives and stifles all dissension, sports are going on! And there's dancing!


Wait just a second there. The U.S. already is the strongest country in the world.

No ballots today.

I have send my ballot.Will it be counted?

Sure! Why not?

And the number 1 artist has changed!

I'm so terribly indecisive...

.5 50 cent
1. Pixies
2. Radiohad
3. Pink Floyd

I'm back from my holidays (part 1) in Barcelona but tomorrow I go to Deauville for my holidays (part 2) until August 16th so it will be too late to me for doing my list...
Is it possible to have a delay until August 18th ?

Hey, as little as I may like Bush, at least I can have two children and not go to jail. At least you can put a show on television exclusively devoted to attacking the guy and not be censored or imprisoned.

I'd take our jerk over theirs any day of the week.

List sent!

Hi Dumbangel-

Go ahead and submit your list. However, I probably won't be able to start posting results until Friday the 22nd in that case.

But surely you can be Chinese and have as many children as you like, if you simply hide them every now and then.

I bet a little challenge like that makes everything more satisfying.

sent !
Hope you received it

Down with the USA!

(Hey, I just want to be popular.)

Sorry. My last comment was stupid. But if you are going to criticize the US, there are more valid criticisms to be made.

It is patently ridiculous to compare stifling of dissent in the US to the stifling of dissent in China.

The First Amendment actually works. You might not be able to get people to agree with you here, but you can certainly be free to say whatever you want.

The US is not all bad. OK. I'll stop now. Please just ignore this rant.

Four lists received today makes Moonbeam a happy boy.

Don't worry, be Moonbeam.

I'll assume that my list was received (odd choices and all).

I probably shouldn't have mentioned politics in the first place on a music board. I apologize. Worldwide repression just tends to be something that really angers me.

20 lists have been received! An artist can no longer place in the top 100 with a single vote of number 1! The nitty is gettin' gritty!

I'm still planning on sending the list, hopefully within deadline

mine's coming soon

My list is on the way. I had a top 200 list from 2005 and it still took this long to tweak it.

It is patently ridiculous to compare stifling of dissent in the US to the stifling of dissent in China.


Is your serious reply to:


But surely you can be Chinese and have as many children as you like, if you simply hide them every now and then. I bet a little challenge like that makes everything more satisfying.

ballot sent! it ain't perfect but i'm sick of messing with it

The list is signed, sealed and delivered, I'm yours.

Moonbeam, you should have gotten my list as well.

The forum is about music, not politics. So, sorry to have initiated (yes, I'm guilty) the US-China discussion.

I just e-mailed my ballot.

I've received lists from the following:

BillAdama
Stephan
Kevin
Damosuzuki
Lonesome Panda
Tim
Sonofsamiam
Jonah
John
Paul
Daniel
Depeche Mode
Henrik
Miguel
Penguin
Nicolas
Toni
Michel
Vgrd
Andre
Fred
Stammer
Greg
Rune
Rocky Raccoon
Mitchell Stirling
Harold Wexler

That means that there are many who participated in the albums and/or songs poll who haven't voiced their opinions yet! Yes, I'm looking at the following:

Ajackson
Anthony
Chris
David
Dumbangel
Ed Ames
Georgie
Giuseppe
Honorio
Jacek
Jem
jonmarck
Juan
Loophole
Mark
Midaso
Mike
Mo
netjade
Nicolas
Otisredding
Pop Elton
Rendle
Schleuse
Schwah
Slush
Snusmumrik
SuperFurry
They Call Me the Swede
Tom
Twister
Weezy

Get those lists in!