Schleuse, I think its interesting what you said about Dylan because I instantly liked him (and I'm not generally well informed about anything). For me it was jazz. I was exposed to it for a looooong time before it clicked. Suddenly it started to make sense, but that was based on lots of exploring into other areas of music such as old blues, etc.)
Which leads me to the next point. There are two kinds of knowledge that will help you appreciate music better: (1) knowledge about the historical context and (2) a more expansive musical palette (i.e., "knowledge" about the musical context). The second kind is more involuntary, but probably explains why I didn't like jazz until the musical backstory got comfortable in my mind.
But I didn't need any of that for Bob. I must have been born pre-wired to like Bob. As soon as I heard that the sun wasn't yellow, but in fact chicken, I was on board.
(3) Knowledge of musical performance/theory – ie. playing any type of instrument.
Accounts for a portion of my appreciation of music; albeit not the biggest portion, but it certainly has an effect on my musical preferences. As a guitarist, four examples come to mind right away – Hendrix, Nick Drake, Jonny Greenwood, and Jack White. Each had a unique approach to the guitar, and hearing it in their records adds to my appreciation and enjoyment.
I'm basing my list on pure enjoyment. We have critics to evaluate the worth and importance of things, and while knowledge of a song's influence and history can affect my enjoyment of it, at the end of the day, there's going to be a few Roxette songs in my list. Deal with it!
As a guitarist who knows nothing about scales or soloing but can play rhythm well enough I am fond of songs with cool chord progressions that are fun to play on my acoustic. I've got an old electric Les Paul knockoff made in the 60's that has a pretty decent sound but I never play it.
It bugs me when I love a song but can't play it on my guitar in any accurate way. But, I still love Television.
I heard someone put it this way: Music either hits you in the head, the heart, the feet or the groin. It can make you think, feel, dance or lust. (Personally I add the fingers too, for the reason Anthony mentioned above.) If it hits in two or more of those places, well, then you've got a hit! Still, my problem is that I find it difficult to reconcile these separate goals. How can I judge a song that's intended to make you think (Kid A era Radiohead, for example) against one that's supposed to make you feel (Otis Redding)? To me it's like picking a favourite animal or a favourite eating utensil. Each one is meant to do different things!
Regardless, I don't want to discourage submissions. I just felt I should give some sort of explanation.
Jonmark, you've articulated very well exactly why I can't do this project. I already regret a lot of my album selections (i.e., somehow I just FORGOT to include "All Mod Cons" by The Jam and "Steve McQueen" by Prefab Sprout. Ugh!) I know I would have severe buyer's remorse even if I could get through the ranking.
But most of you all are more rankers/listers than me anyway, so I look forward to seeing your submissions.
Who cares if it's not totally reflective. The goal is to get as many submissions as possible to get an overall feel of how our community feels. I really hope you guys decide to submit some kind of list.
yes, of course, instrument playing and singing
that's why I dig old blues so much (my favorite instrument is the acoustic gtr)
Being a musician (amateur of course) plays a big part in my choices
Also, the more you listen to music, your focus changes.
When I was a kid I would focus on the lyrics. When I was like 13 and just starting to really listen to music, I focused on the vocal melody more.
When I got to 18 or so, I noticed instrumental skill more and more, and started listening to classic rock so the whole context by which I judged new music was changing.
Few years later, now I like the interplay, the emotion, the playing off musical context, and the overall feel in addition to the lyrics, vocal melody and instrumental skill. All a song really needs to be enjoyable is to hit one or two of those aspects really well.
My brother went to Berklee school of music so he likes jam bands and such with good chord progressions and solid musical theory. My father grew up in the 60s so he likes stuff influenced by the great music from that time, and my mother doesn't really listen to music so she only gets into soft of softer folky music. (Her Christmas present from me: The Reminder).
And my best friend loved classical before he even accepted that popular music could be good, so he's more affected by vituosic guitar playing like with Hendrix. (And whenever he likes something like Guns N Roses or Depeche Mode he says things like "It's trashy, but it's supposed to be!")
The only constant is "The more you listen to music the better you are at judging it", otherwise it's a matter of your own perspective determined by your own experience.
I'm going to start going down the AM top artists lists just to brainstorm my favorite songs. I'll list all of the ones that *really* affect me, then see how long that list is.
Question, does the order matter, or is it going to be like most singles polls, just a list of inclusions?
I'm not a 100 percent sure Loophole, you'd have to ask Moonbeam, but I don't think it would be much harder to give every song the average amount of points.
An unordered list is better than no list at all
And in a way, it is even better (although less practical for calculations) than an ordered list.
But I gave an order, very unsure. So far I have ranked a little more than 200 titles
Just submitted my list and guess what? It's ordered!
The ordering was the difficult part, not to get to a selection of 200 songs. No comments from my side, I had a hard time to find suitable comments to the top 10 or so songs.
Ordered list is on its way, and yeah, it's 1000. I'm really happy with it though, and think it's about as representative as I can get with where I'm at these days. Here's a year breakdown for the curious...
Hopefully the emphasis on 65-74 doesn't make me look like a total classic rocker -- it's probably more of a reflection of the great soul, jazz, and Tropicalia stuff I love so much from that era. (And yes, it is a peak period for some of our much-loved "acclaimed" artists, who do make their mark.)
Anyway, that was a lot of fun, mainly as I dug out a lot of stuff in the last weeks while attempting to order.
The lists are really starting to pour in! I've gotten at least a dozen in the past few days- which is great! My own list is still taking some time, although the process is fun.
I was actually surprised it had more votes in my list than 1971, but '71 remains my favorite year and had way more tracks in the upper regions of my list.
I've come to the realization that relative few things in my Top 200 will likely make the final list, but that's OK. Maybe some people here will check out some of the more seemingly obscure stuff, and I'll be sure to do the same with everyone else's lists. The learning opportunity involved with exercises like this is so great.
Aaaaaaaargh I forgot Like Dylan in the movies (biggest recent grower).
Well, not surprising but I have 94 songs upon 200 which has been made on the 00s... with 2005 as the winner year (which has surprised me, I thought 1997 would win, but well, no song from the most acclaimed of this year so "only" 17 songs made the list)
I've only just discovered Neil Young's excellent repertoire (I know, shoot me), and recently listened to "Rust Never Sleeps" for the first time, and I feel I should give him a few inclusions too. I think I'll have to expand my top 300.. sonofsamiam, here I come!
R.E.M. is my favorite band, but that seems to be based on albums only. Stipe & Co. only have 9 songs in my top 200, The Beatles win with 10 songs. Way too many, if you ask me. Well, I've already submitted my list, better luck next time ...
I haven't submitted mine yet, but my current draft has 1 Beatles song. There's one Beatles song bubbling under, so they could get in with two (probably not).
My bands with the most songs are Blur and New Order with 9 songs each.
How many artists is everyone representing? I've got 112 in mine.
Moonbeam, can I submit my list before 31st in th evening (GMT) or will it be too late for you ?
What time do you stop (I'll send my list at the last minute)
Top artist: Songs in my top 200
Bob Dylan: 2
Bruce Springsteen: 2
David Bowie: 2
Elvis Costello: 2
Elvis Presley: 2
Leonard Cohen: 2
Marvin Gaye: 2
Pixies: 2
Public Enemy: 2
Stevie Wonder: 2
The Beatles: 2
The Kinks: 2
The Rolling Stones: 2
The Smiths: 2
Van Morrison: 2
I'm in the middle of application writing and term start and what-not, so unless a minor miracle happens (like January suddenly having 32 days), I'm unlikely to make it, but I'll follow the unveiling of the results with undiminished enthusiasm.
I guess PM means post midday (lunch time). I believe AM lives in Greenwich, ENGLAND, not Greenwich Village new York...so 4.39 PM means that I have one day and 7 hours and 21 minutes left to midnight to post my list, which, Moonbeam, I already did a few days ago...I use to be wrong about these things...so correct me...
Another idea is that it's 24.00 hours on the LAST place in the world that is the limit...in any case, don't be late, submit your list as it is in time.
I got mine in. Let me know if you haven't received it, Moonbeam.
I went up to 350, but here's some statistics for my top-200:
7 entries: Beatles, Beck
6 entries: Bjork
5 entries: Pavement, Prince
4 entries: Arcade Fire, Bob Dylan, David Bowie, The Kinks, PJ Harvey, Radiohead, Sly and the Family Stone, Super Furry Animals, The Who
I took my philosophy of doing it fast and dirty to its logical conclusion--last night, I threw everything out and started over. The list of 200 I just submitted was assembled and ranked in about 3 hours. No agonizing, no fine-tuning, done by the seat of my pants.
It's the only way I could have done it without going nuts. And I'm pretty happy with the result; I'm sure in a couple of days (or a couple of hours) I'm going to think of something I should have included, but so be it.
(Given my method, I didn't mess with figuring out years or statistics, but songs ranged from 1930 to 2007, and I'm pretty sure R.E.M. had the most songs--eight.)
Sorry if this has already been addressed: Are we talking the 31st of January according to the timestamp this site goes by, the time where Moonbeam is, or anywhere on earth?
I'm giving it a stab but we're coming down to the wire.
I just submitted mine as a google doc. I'll probably update it with some notes over the next day or so, but I won't play around with the order of the songs so you can add those to your master uber list whenever you want.
Just an update! I have now received 24 lists, and the consensus is starting to form. Slush, I've been unable to access your list, as I don't have a google account. So far, 2885 songs have been chosen by at least one poster!
The lists I have received and recorded so far:
Andre
Anthony
BillAdama
Doug
Eduard
Fred
Giuseppe
Henrik
Honorio
John
Jonah
Lonesome Panda
Mark Propp
Midaso
Miguel
Mitchell Stirling
Mo
Neoptolemos
Otisredding
Ozphoenix
Pop Elton
Schleuse
Schwah
Vgrd
Nicolas, that's fine! I'm not going to be too strict about it. Truth be told, I probably won't be able to post the results until Monday, Australia time.
I wouldn't say you should change in all your Dylan albums in Moneybrother albums, but you could definitely chuck out some of his 80's albums for Blood Panic and To Die Alone, if you're out of shelf space.
Just sent my list, so if you could let me know if you got it, that would be great. The songs list seems a lot more arbitrary to me than the albums list, with mood being a much bigger deciding factor. I could see many of the songs outside my top 30 moving up or down as much as 40 for 50 spots on any given day. Oh well, I'm sure I've left off about 10 songs I forgot, but I was pretty thorough. This was much harder for me since I was starting basically from scratch, unlike with my albums list. Looking forward to final result.
Eight Beatles songs by the way, but there was one other artist that scored nine songs. Now that I type that, I'm even rethinking my list at this late date. Too late now.
Well, my statistics are a bit too revealing. I made a conscious effort to not have so many songs from the 2000s, but since I did a lot of this based on iTunes counts this decade is overly represented (I did cut it down from about 110 out of 200 songs). Plus, it has been since 2005 that the real music nerdiness has come. Oh well, there needs to be some counterbalance to all those Beatles songs
1965: 7 songs
1977: 7 songs
1985: 6 songs
1998: 8 songs
2005: 18 songs (I think you can thank this on the fact that this was the year when I overcompensated and became a total music nerd, so I know this year's music best).
My list is a top 100, that's the best than I can do.
I love lists but I've never made a list over 100 (except for my "top ex-girlfriends" ) and I'll never make a list over 100.
More seriously, I'm not really into songs lists, I prefer albums lists. Like many people here, I think songs are too hard to rank.
If a list should contain 200 songs, people tend to want to rank all the songs they love and then even a top 200 is never enough. And a top 200 (or more for some crazy people who want to rank 1000 songs!) is very hard and boring to read for the other people. I prefer when the number of songs (or albums for top albums lists) is more restricted. I would have loved better a poll like this : as Nick Hornby in his book "31 songs" (a very good book), everyone has to make an unranked selection of 31 songs ("why 31 ?" : ask to Nick Hornby) that have been important in your life. I would have loved that.
No matter, my list is done, it's a top 100, there are songs from 1957 to 2006 (the '60s and '70s are well-represented), there is just one song by artist (except one artist who have 2 songs). I've a fine list I think. These are all great and fantastic songs. I've made my list in 3 hours (2 hours to make the selection and 1 hour to rank), no headaches. It's my january 31 list, no more. Tomorrow's list probably would be different.
And a top 200 (or more for some crazy people who want to rank 1000 songs!) is very hard and boring to read for the other people.
Why is it that people assume their opinions about list can be ascribed to everyone else? (This coming from one of those "crazy people" who submitted 1000 songs.)
I'm sorry, but just because it's hard for you, doesn't make it somehow "wrong" for everyone else -- I love seeing the big lists, it shows a lot of breadth, and even more importantly is likely to steer me in new directions.
I mean, if any forum should be safe for posting big lists free of criticism or questioning, it should be this one.
"There Is Nothing More To Say" from Begin is also quite great, but I can see the criticism about the super-soft-pop on there. They're sort of the halfway point between The Beach Boys and The Free Design (not a bad thing in my book).
I'm sorry Sonofsamiam, I didn't want to hurt you. I don't try to denigrate this poll or the people who make big list. I just wanted to point the fact that the too much of too much of too much top songs, top albums and top of everything maybe isn't the best way the draw people's attention to something.
And however I'm someone who's a list fanatic. But the overabundance disturb me a little. That's just my point my point of vue. I respect everyone's opinion.
Just looked at my list and noticed that the Husker Du entry has a blank in the place of the song. The song should be "Turn on the News." I also sent an e-mail on this. Thanks.
I'm sorry Sonofsamiam, I didn't want to hurt you. I don't try to denigrate this poll or the people who make big list. I just wanted to point the fact that the too much of too much of too much top songs, top albums and top of everything maybe isn't the best way the draw people's attention to something.
And however I'm someone who's a list fanatic. But the overabundance disturb me a little. That's just my point my point of vue. I respect everyone's opinion.
No big deal -- I certainly wasn't hurt, just a tad annoyed. I actually suffer from list exhaustion too, at least as far as sheer number of lists. That's why I save up my reserves for just songs & albums, because that's where the most fun is at.
OK, I'm going to reveal the last song on my list. It's Robin Williams! with..."Shakespeare (A Meltdowners Nightmare). Yes, he actually utters some kind of singing in the middle of all the talking. Recommended.
Artists (top 200) 120 artists
Beatles 11
Springsteen 10
Tom Waits 7
Georges Brassens 6
Jacques Brel 6
The Divine Comedy 5
Leadbelly 4
Bob Dylan 4
Neil Young 4
Stevie Wonder 4
Robert Johnson 4
The Kinks 3
Jimi Hendrix 3
David Bowie 3
Robert Wyatt 3
After countless hours of tabulating and re-tabulating, the list seems to be complete! A total of 36 lists have graced my presence, all of which have been very fascinating. The vast wealth of knowledge present in this forum is evident in the nearly 4,000 songs that were nominated. I've definitely got my homework ahead of me!
I received lists from the following:
Ajackson
Andre
Anthony
BillAdama
Dumbangel
Eduard
Fred
Georgie
Giuseppe
Henrik
Honorio
John
Jonah
Lonesome Panda
Mark Propp
Maurice
Michel
Midaso
Miguel
Mitchell Stirling
Moonbeam
Neoptolemos
Nicolas
Otisredding
Ozphoenix
Pop Elton
Rendle
Rocky Raccoon
Rune
Schleuse
Schwah
Slush
Sonofsamiam
Stammer
Toni
Vgrd
I'm going to crash for awhile, and though I may post some preliminaries, the big list won't be unveiled until Monday, most probably.
My list might be done by Monday. (Work, being the main problem). I know it won't be included in the stats, but that probably won't make a difference. I'll throw it up with the individual lists in case anyone is interested.
Rolling Stones 5
Clash, Nirvana, Pixies, REM, Replacements 4
GBV 3 (Plus one Pollard Solo)
Janes Addiction 3
'60s 44
'70s 39
'80s 55
'90s 48
'00s 14
I don't think the low number for the current decade is a reflection on my opinion of the quality of music being put out now but just a need to see which songs pass the test of time criteria.