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Bracketology: The Final Four

Good people, in the last five months, you have ranked songs in 84 different brackets. Just one more, and we’ll be finished:

FINAL FOUR
1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
20. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”
27. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
146. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”

Ballots are due on midnight, Saturday, November 25. (If you’re in the US, note that this will be during Thanksgiving weekend, so plan accordingly.)

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

The first and last combined comment marks the ending of a wonderful journey. I'd like to thank schleuse for his idea and excellent execution and everyone for their continuous posts that more than once made me smile. It's been a journey in which I've found many treasures and rediscovered old favorites. Now, for the songs. The greatest song of all time obviously wins, but the second place goes to the song with possibly the greatest beat of all time. The third place is for the Stones, with their apocalyptic masterpiece. Last place goes to John and Paul not because it's a bad song, it's great in fact, but the few annoying parts are too annoying to come close to the other three.

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
2. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”
4. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

FINAL FOUR

The finals turned out to be much better than I anticipated. All four of these songs are songs I listen to frequently. When the first cut was made and even when it went to 16 I was a little worried that I wasn't going to have much to choose from in the finals and I'd have to go with a song I only kind of liked. That's not the case- I'd definitely consider all of these songs for my own top 10 and two are in my own final four.

Michael Jackson only made one other song as a solo artist (Thriller) that came close to Billie Jean. That album was something else wasn't it? Three singles, and each one could be the defining song of the 80's. I don't know what I want from Jackson. Part of me wants a grand comeback and an album that is a return to at least Dangerous form. The other part wants him to stay out of view because we're finally getting to the point where his music is talked about as great-without the past 15 years being mentioned. He'll never make another Billie Jean but it's enticing to think if he'd have another Black or White in him.

A Day in the Life is not my favorite Beatles song. But, it is their crowning achievement in a catalog of hits. The one thing that really stands out about this song is that before A Day in the Life Lennon/McCartney was just a songwriting duo to the casual fan. Some people could tell what songs were more Lennon and which were McCartney but not as obvious as this. A Day in the Life took a classic Lennon song and a classic McCartney song and merged the two into one great Beatles song. Never before had the Lennon/McCartney brand been so apparent and so wonderfully showcased.

Dylan is a living legend here in MN- even more so than in the rest of the world. I don't really revere him as a person...a lot of people want to hold on to his every word, but to me he seems more like that guy you want to punch in the face at a party. But, the man could write songs and none much better than Like a Rolling Stone.

The Stones of that period are the total opposite for me. They were the guys everyone wanted to be around and it's enjoyable to watch them play music. Heck, it's even charming to watch them talk about Altamont. For some reason, I find Charlie Watts the coolest guy to ever to play in a band. But, their music means very little to me...most of it I find pretty unappealing. Gimme Shelter is not one of those songs. It's like another band stepped into their shoes when they recorded this that exuded the same coolness and energy of the real Rolling Stones. Because, I don't think they ever came even close to this before or after.

1. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
2. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”
3. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
4. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”

And my personal final four:

(Sweet 16:

1: Don't Worry Baby, In My Life, People Get Ready, Paint it Black
2: A Day in the Life, Waterloo Sunset, Tomorrow Never Knows, That's Alright Mama
3: Thunder Road, Don't You Want Me, 96 Tears, Let's Stay Together
4: Billie Jean, Tracks of My Tears, Will You Love Me Tomorrow, Blue Monday)

1. Michael Jackson- Billie Jean
2. Beach Boys- Don't Worry Baby
3. Beatles- A Day In the Life
4. Bruce Springsteen- Thunder Road

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Wow, what a group – I love all four songs. Each are perfect representations of their respective artist(s), their genres, and their time. But above all, they’re really just wonderful examples of the transcendent beauty of music.

1. THE BEATLES, “A DAY IN THE LIFE” (4,4,3)

No surprises here. My four points goes to the greatest song from the greatest group in pop music history. The closer of their magnum opus, and the type of masterpiece that most artists spend a lifetime trying to emulate, parallel and equal but never achieve, evidenced by decades passed. This Lennon/McCartney creation just might be the perfect song.

2. THE ROLLING STONES, “GIMME SHELTER” (4,4,4)

It’s the tournament’s Cinderella story, but out of all Stones songs, this is the one that deserves to be here. A true classic, unparalleled in its violent, end-of-the-world fervor.

3. BOB DYLAN, “LIKE A ROLLING STONE” (?,3,3)

Amazing. The snare shot, the snarling vocals, the organ… it all fits together in a beautiful six minutes of electro-folk bliss.

4. MICHAEL JACKSON, “BILLIE JEAN” (4,3,4)

If you can get past the baby-dangling, Bahrain-recluse, Neverland-sleepover, weirdo lifestyle, Michael Jackson’s story is sort of a heartbreaking one. An exploited child star exposed to things that nobody at such a young age should be subjected to – an abusive father, brothers who entertained groupies on the road, a demanding music industry. But if it hadn’t happened that way, “Billie Jean” might have never existed. So, listening to this song is bittersweet – an 80s pop nugget that came from a very dark place, but the cruel irony is that it’s all the more powerful because of it. This song is amazing, and I’m glad it made it this far.


Out of 44 possible points - not 48, since I missed a week, and not including this round - I gave these gems a combined 40 points. Not too shabby at all.

Thanks schleuse – this was fun.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

The list is good but it's fun so here are my choices.

1. The Beatles- A Day in the Life,with its mix of Avant, classical, psychedelic with a forty second chord then goes into a hidden track. The playing is top notch, great vocals, drumming piano and bass. A pop-rock masterpiece. Many artists in many genres have tried to duplicate this nothing like it in music.
2. Bob Dylan- I will show that I am not being biased and pick this song over Gimme Shelter. A just like this song over Give Me Shelter.
3. The Rolling Stones- Stones deserve better, Their influence on music is just as great as Dylan. The song I would have picked was Sympathy For The Devil.
4. Michael Jackson- Billie Jean, I really don't know how this song is with this group. Like the song a lot though.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Firstly, I would like to send my thanks to schleuse. I was late in discovering this forum, and it was specifically because of the lure of Bracketology that I stayed here. Not only the idea, but to pull it off so metuclously, hats off.

The songs, well, they're great! Four stone wall classics from four excellent albums. From a personal point of view, it's slightly disappointing that there's no representative of the last 20 years, but that's a common theme with acclaimed music in general. But that's splitting hairs, it's a really very strong group indeed.

So, in reverse order...

FINAL FOUR
4) The Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter.
I acquired (or perhaps rediscovered) a new level of respect for this upon listening through these four songs. The interplay between Jagger and Merry Clayton on vocals is a spectacle - Jagger quite possibly being outshone for once in his life! Apocalyptic lyrics, fantastic guitar work, excellent song by a legenday band.

3) Michael Jackson - Billie Jean.
The song of the four that will demand you move instantaneously. Surely the single highlight of an already stellar solo career - the groovy bass and crisp drum sound is what just clinches third place ahead of the Stones, but they're all so close in reality. Quite obvious upon listening that it's the newest song here too.

2) The Beatles - A Day In The Life.
Ouch, that was hard to type. In all truth, there are other Beatles songs that I prefer to this one, but there isn't one that commands my respect quite like ADITL. So much to say, but it's all common knowledge. I would like to mention Ringo's impressive performance, underrated in my opinion. But then he was always gonna be overshadowed here. Contender for Lennon's best lyrics too. I like the way that their playful side comes out as well, especially with the high pitch sound at the end designed to annoy dog owners. Such an incredible journey of a song.

1) Bob Dylan - Like A Rolling Stone.
So there it is. The greatest of the great. Not as effortlessly cool as Gimme Shelter, not as funky as Billie Jean, not as experimental as A Day In The Life, but still it comes out on top. I think what sets it apart from the bulk of Dylan's songbook is the density of the music - organ, piano, guitar, bass, drums, tambourine, harmonica all present, but without any suggestion that it could detract from the vocals (which are probably his best). And the lyrics, obviously, are from the top drawer. I still find it as exciting as I ever have, and it would be the perfect winner of Bracketology.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” - Dylan's mildly annoyed and Al Kooper has an organ riff. Nine minutes later...
2. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” - I originally had Gimme Shelter ahead of this, because I put both songs through the "If I could listen to only one of these, which one would I listen to?" test. Then I remembered that it's not always about what I want to listen to, it's also about what the songs accomplished. Gimme Shelter took rock music into the seventies and showed a side to the Stones we hadn't yet seen. On the other hand A Day in the Life melded pop and art so well that it set a higher bar for creativity in pop music. Even its placement on the album was an artistic effort. It was after the Sgt. Pepper's reprise; the goodbye, so it felt like more of a coda to the entire effort then a stand-alone track, a feeling exponentiated by the crashing orchestra. There wasn't and still isn't anything like this. It showed us how albums SHOULD be thought of. It taught us how to listen to music properly.
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” - This song has no depth. It's a catchy tune but there's not much behind it.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. BOB DYLAN, “LIKE A ROLLING STONE”: The slightly misogynist lyrics bother me a little bit, and it’s not the Dylan song I’d want to put in the time capsule (that would be “Desolation Row”), but it’s a perfectly realized pop masterpiece. It occurs to me that a good comparison to this song would be the movie that’s at the top of the other great critical-consensus list at TSPDT: Citizen Kane. Both “LaRS” and Kane were groundbreaking and changed their artforms forever. And in both cases, the “story,” seemingly complex, is actually very simple—it’s the form, not the content, that makes both works deserving of their #1 rankings.
2. THE ROLLING STONES, “GIMME SHELTER”: I don’t have much more to add about this one. Like the song above, it’s not typical of the artist—but it is their best. The late 1960s are the most overrated period in pop history, mostly because the first serious rock critics looked back at that era through rose-colored glasses. Today, “Gimme Shelter” is both the corrective to that kind of dippy nostalgia, and a validation of how passionate, turbulent and scary the late 60s actually were.
3. THE BEATLES, “A DAY IN THE LIFE”: This has to be the archetypal Beatles song—pop-oracular lyrics from John, a kitchen-sink middle section from Paul, and George Martin turning the band’s wildest imaginings into reality through his studio wizardry. Oh, and drugs. I still don’t think it’s their best song. Its aspirations to avant-garde art music are valid, and important to know, but they’re not a reason to give the song extra points, in my book.
4. MICHAEL JACKSON, “BILLIE JEAN”: A good song. Severely outclassed here. I wish I could give more support to the youngest song in a group with three 60s songs (my own final four includes songs from 1965, 1979, 1991 and 2003), but I can’t.

I’m sure I’m not the first person to notice this (in fact, I know I’m not—jonmarck commented on it a while back), but personal bracketology is much, much harder than “official” bracketology, just because in personal bracketology, fewer of one’s favorites are eliminated. The winner of my own tournament is “London Calling,” by a nose over “Like a Rolling Stone.” But you know what? I feel like if I ran my own tournament ten times, I’d come up with ten different winners.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

My vote is gonna be extremely boring, for it is exactly matching the order on AM:

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
2. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”
3. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
4. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”

I like all 4 songs, but Bob wins with a brilliant folk song, which never gets tired to listen to. Bob and his song, no complete unknown.

The Beatles in second place for making that revolutionary song composition, not listenable at all times, but on a regular basis highly interesting.

Was never much of a disco fan (to paraphrase Gruppo Sportivo: "Disco really made it, it's empty and I hate it"), but Billie is pretty good stuff to dance on. Jackson's highlight of his highlight album.

Well, just a shot away, Stones on 4th place only, but a great song as well. Saw them live once ("De Kuip", Rotterdam, end of 80's), the woman that sang back then did a pretty good job, but did not get even close to the woman singing on Let It Bleed.

Special thanks to you, schleuse. That was a great exercise, very revealing to listen to all these songs and an honour to share some good and strong opinions. Fun indeed!

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

"But you know what? I feel like if I ran my own tournament ten times, I’d come up with ten different winners."

I agree with you, schleuse. Our moods differ day by day, and so does our musical preference. Bracketology is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna pick .

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Back in 1982 when I was 16 years old my buddies decided to put together a band for the high school talent show. I had to put all my lawn-mowing money into a cheapo electric guitar and amp. (All I had was an accoustic). We had to teach our bass player how to play the bass. (He was a drummer).

I promise that this story has a point.

During a time of Duran Duran and Van Halen, we had one friend who was really into "odd" music. And he was the one with the talent. He picked two songs for us to learn and perform: "Like A Rolling Stone" and "A Day In The Life." Pretty cool, huh? Maybe we just knew how to pick good material...?

Anyway, the teachers loved us. None of the students had ever heard Bob Dylan, but we managed to come in second place to a hair band full of rich kids with fancy equipment and a recording studio in the basement of the drummer's parent's mansion.

And now for my votes.

First place: "Like A Rolling Stone." No doubt about it. It just SOUNDS great in every respect. The rhymes, the voice, the organ, the snare. Epic without being grandiose. Will be played around campfires 50 years from now. No orchestra required. And it changed pop music more than the other three.

Second place: A Day In The Life. There's a lot to love here, but its a bit gimmicky and orchestrated for my simple tastes. (My first public singing was Paul's silly part of this song. My talented friend was Dylan and Lennon!)

Third place: Gimme Shelter. Very Evocative. Well performed.

Fourth place: Billie Jean. The best song of 1982, but not something my hack band could have pulled off. (Dylan leaves a lot more room for rough edges.) A wonderfully produced pop song.

Thanks for a good exercise schleuse. It's time for me to put down my ranking pen for awhile.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” #1 for a reason
146. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter” One of the Stones' best.
27. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” Good ole' fun, funkyness
20. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” Well, I've probably said all along that this isn't my favorite song, though I definitely do respect the hell out of it.

Also, this was a great idea and it was Bracketology that got me hooked on the forums.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”
No doubt about: the greatest Beatles' song ever. Masterpiece!
2. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
The rock history itself...
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”
Great song, but not my favourite one by Rolling Stones
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
... in the top four??? I think in "Thriller" there are at least 2 or 3 songs better than this one

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. The Beatles - "A Day In The Life"

I adore Lennon and McCartney, both together and seperately. But even within The Beatles "A Day In The Life" marks a rare occasion that found the pair of them pouring their talents and passions into the same stream. And the result is mind-blowing: epic, yet tight and melodic, psychedelically silly while simultaneously heart-felt and resonant. A really amazing accomplishment.

2. Bob Dylan - "Like A Rolling Stone"

A great song musically: a rollicking, great pounding surge o' the stuff - all topped off with the golden touch of, and let's be fair, the greatest lyricist the world has ever seen.

3. The Rolling Stones - "Gimme Shelter"

A great slice of Rolling rock 'n' roll, but well out of its depth, competition-wise.

4. Michael Jackson - "Billie Jean"

Oh dear. Probably Michael Jackson's best song, OK. And it is tight, I've got no problems with "Billie Jean". But it's taking the piss, sat alongside Dylan and The Beatles. Put it next to George Michael and Duran Duran, where it belongs, and it'd sit smugly on top of the pile. But it's a pile several country miles lower than the divine talents of Dylan and the freaking Beatles. Jesus.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Without further ado:

1) The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter” -- The funny thing is I'm not such a big Stones fan. I like a few of their songs a lot, enjoy Some Girls, but do not feel the need to listen to them too often. But over the years this song has risen and risen in my estimation. Until it stands here at the top of this list and my personal bracketology. What makes it so great? It's Mick at pretty much the apex of his powers, which for all of his cheese are considerable. It is as good an interplay on the chugging guitars as any of their songs. But it has something that the rest of the Stones canon does not: Merry Clayton. Her contribution lifts what would already be one of their greatest songs into this discussion of the handful of greatest songs of all time. The other elements all enhance: the tension, the grime, the occasional sloppiness. And when your ready to revel in the sin and the ugliness -- because this song has made it sound so beautiful and enticing -- you are presented with slight relief when Mick (of all people) promises that "love is just a kiss away."

2) The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” -- This song made a very late surge for me. For a bit I considered putting it above Gimme Shelter. This all underscores for me how ephemeral these minute distinctions I'm drawing are. I mean, this went out to "Subterranean Homesick Blues" in my personal bracketology -- because I was on a serious kick with that song at the time. Now I'm being drawn back to this beautiful, shocking, monumental number. This was closer to becoming #1 than my personal bracketology might have indicated.

3) Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” -- Losing ground at the end, but never in danger of being surpassed by Billie Jean. The spite and contempt that is shocking in the lyrics, does not come through as well in Bob's delivery. I think that one reason that I really like "Don't Think Twice" best of all his songs is how naked the contrast between his lyrics and music is, and how his delivery bridges that gap and draws out the complexities in both. Here the music rocks, and the lyrics bite, but not always in the song do they really work together. (Again, I'm splitting fine hairs on what is quite obviously a masterpiece.)

4) Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” -- I've been shocked at how well this has done. I did not realize that there was such love for this song. I like it: its supple, insanely catchy, and has a very fine groove. But the idea that Michael Jackson enters the Final Four as the sole soul/R&B representative (and "Billie Jean" really is much more pop/disco) above Otis Redding, James Brown, Sly and the Family Stone, Stevie Wonder, and any of the great Motown singles (including his childhood work with the Jackson 5) is a tad disappointing.

Personal Bracketology:

1) The Rolling Stones - "Gimme Shelter" -- See above

2) Otis Redding - "Try a Little Tenderness" -- I have talked about how much I like a song that builds well. This is the archetype. From the beginning, slightly rinky-dink horn line to the final fade out on a wailing, stuttering Otis with the complementary wailing organ, you are transported. And throughout Otis rasps and declaims -- at first with with precision, then growing in passion, till he's reached wild abandon. For me, the definition of soul. One small problem with the engineering -- his vocal line drops in the mix around 2 minutes in. A minor flaw in a rock hard, glistening diamond of a song.

3) The Flamingos - "I Only Have Eyes For You" -- I'm not sure that I can express how beautiful this song is. Such silky lead vocals. The languid tempo is puncutated and enervated with each "Doowopsh'wop." It's very possible most people do not get this vibe from the song, but to me it's tender, yet infused with a sexual energy.

4) Stevie Wonder - "Superstition" -- I'll just repeat my comment from earlier in the tournament: Incredible all around. Perfect marriage of arrangement, vocals, and groove. In a sterling 70's career, this is the highlight. (With "I Wish" a close second.) Wonder at his most funky and least schmaltzy.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”: no sane musician could claim for inventing the “love song” but honestly Bob Dylan could claim (if he wanted) for being the creator of the “hate song”. From “Ballad in Plain D” to “Idiot Wind” he perfected this kind of personal verbal attack, being Suze Rotolo’s sister in the first case or ex-wife Sarah Lowndes in the second. Warhol’s muse Edie Sedgwich supposedly was the inspiration for the vitriolic “Like a Rolling Stone”, written by Dylan very quickly as an explosion of rage. But let’s hear Dylan himself: “It was ten pages long. It wasn’t called anything, just a rhythm thing on paper all about my steady hatred directed at some point that was honest. In the end it wasn’t hatred, it was telling someone something they didn’t know, telling them they were lucky. Revenge, that’s a better word” (from the liner notes of “Live 1966” . The Dylan revenge song is the most consistent song ever and managed to be simultaneously groundbreaking and era-defining. Let’s get it up to a deservedly number one.
2. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”: Lennon wrote a song from fragments of newspapers (it was usual for him these times, he wrote “Mr. Kite” from a circus advertisement and “Good Morning” from a TV commercial), played acoustic guitar and sang with a haunting beautiful voice. McCartney wrote and sang a middle section, played piano and bass and was responsible for the drug references (“I had a smoke / and I went into a dream” or “I’d love to turn you on” . Starr played the best drums you can actually hear on a Beatles song (well, along with “Rain” drumming). And Martin wrote probably the most bizarre score for a 41-member classical orchestra: only the lowest tone of the instrument at the beginning and the highest note at the end of the 24 bars, with a line joining the two notes. Lennon even requested for “a sound like the end of the world”. Actually sounded like a new beginning.
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”: the biggest surprise of Bracketology allows us to have the Rock Blessed Trinity the Final Tour (don’t ask me who are the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost). For me it’s the perfect epilogue for the sixties, a decade often seen (like schleuse brilliantly pointed) “through rose-colored glasses” but with a hidden dark face that The Stones exposed so well.
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”: this is the favourite song of Miguel, my 8-year-old son. Although I won’t let him get close to the real Jacko (I’m afraid he’s exactly his type) I’m not bored at all when he ask me for the fifth time while I drive: “Daddy, put again ‘Billie Jean’, please”. In fact I wouldn’t mind to listen to it ten times more.

My personal Final Four:
1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
2. The Beatles, “Strawberry Fields Forever”
3. Marvin Gaye, “What’s Going On”
4. David Bowie, “Heroes”

Schleuse I want to add my congratulations. It’s been a wonderful journey and I really learned and enjoyed a lot the comments from all the posters.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

FINAL FOUR
1- Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”
2- Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone”
3- The Beatles, “A Day in the Life”
4- The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” :

What I love in Dylan’s songs is that the longest they are, the better they get. It’s a uncommon song : always the same melody (3 chords + the bridges), this strange nasal voice, this lazy rhythm, a rather messy production (there is worse later in the album with out of tune guitars), but it’s very strong, and it gets stronger and stronger. The intro is really great : drums, then piano/organ (a future classic in American roots rock, see the Band and Springsteen), the first verses. It is not a Motown-crafted hit like Billie Jean, not a work of modern art like A Day In The Life, not a dark creeping blues like Gimme Shelter. It is not a folk song, it is the first new Bob Dylan song. The lyrics are very good poetry : you perfectly understand their meaning but there are shadows too, but it’s never pretentious. For his first electric song, Dylan, who’s turn from a protest singer into a witted satirist, is really impressive.


2. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean”

This song came out as a single in 1983. I was 13 years old and went to my first party at a friend’s. A guy was playing drums while the records played. We danced, there were girls and boys kissing each other, there were people smoking, I came back with my Lacoste polo stinking of smoke.
It was really exciting. I remember a guy passing me a 45RPM with this strange guy, half black, lying with his white suit, black shirt and a baby tiger on his lap. Everything was strange and new. To me, Billie Jean is THE song of the 80’s. It was huge at the time, and the song is the perfect dance hit. Great drum intro, big melody. And Michael said he had wanted to put the “perfect bass line”, and indeed it is one of the best bass lines in the history of popular music.
I can’t listen to this song without moving in rythm : my leg, my fingers, my head, anything...

3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter”

Everything in the Stones is in that song : the sound, the bluesy athomsphere : the Rolling stones were, much more than Led Zep the group that best understood the essence of the blues : it is all over the song, like a “big black snake creeping in my room “ (Blind Lemon Jefferson), and the song, although the lyrics (as often with the Stones) are difficult to understand, are about sex, death and an invisible threat. What are they seeking shelter from ? They don’t even know, but the weirdest part of that was that the month the song was released, the Altamont murder occured. Chilly, isn’t it ? (Courtesy of AMG review, which taught me a lot about the song)

4. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” :

The Fab Four are my favorite band but I don’t know why I don’t really get that song. In fact it is probably their most “modern” song because it really sounds like 90’s music and indie rock. Problem is I don’t like indie rock that much.
Not that the song is bad : good melodies (it is a collage of two different songs), good drummming, and a nice athmosphere.
I prefer the Beatles when they are more modest. I mean, in the Revolver/Sgt. Pepper’s era they sound like they really want to do something artful, they want to be the best band, they want to beat the Stones and the Beach Boys, and it shows, and some songs lose their spontaneity, even if Revolver is a very good album. And I’m not receptive to all these sound effects. Not that I’m against the principle, but there they don’t add anything to the song. So for once I’ll be the black sheep and reject this song as the weakest of this final ballot.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

my personnal final 4

1. Bruce Springsteen "Thunder Road"
2. Ray Charles "What'd I say"
3. Stevie Wonder "superstition"
4. Otis Redding "Dock of the Bay"

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but A Day in the Life like many people have said in this forum is the song that is most way ahead of it's time, but that seems to be a bad thing here. It's like innovation, execution and what it did for the future for rock music does not matter. I have to defend my favorite band I hear some knocks against the Beatles becuase they were trying to combine art and rock. I have said my peace.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Ok,well I'll be honest - none of these songs are my absolute favourites(not 10 or anything) and I don't listen to them too often but I love all 4 tracks...
1)The Beatles - A Day In The Life:I'm sad in a way that the Beatles have to top this bracket,it is really their crowning achievement though - and still love it on every listen
2)Bob Dylan - Like A Rolling Stone:Of course I respect this song and it's importance - it's just not the sort of thing to listen to every day or anything
3)Michael Jackson - Billie Jean:Well I must say I'm very surprised to see this in the final 4,particularly from the same bracket as Good vibrations and What's Going On. I've definitely appreciated the greatness of this song more as I gave it multiple listens throughout the competition
4)Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter:I'm glad this competition reminded me of how much I used to love this song - i forgot about it for a long time. Outclassed here though I feel,sweet 16 is where it's journey should have ended...

Thanks Schleuse - great game

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

Sal,

As I say, I love the Beatles.
What we are reviewing here are SONGS and not artists, and I'm afraid some of the voters made the confusion.
People voted for ADITL because it was the Beatles, and I'm sorry but it's not honest.
I'll vote for or against artists in the Survivor game;
I wrote a comment on A Day In The Life, not on the Beatles, so don't generalize things.
And last, innovation is not an important critera to me
what I like in a song is the way it moves me, and I may be moved by a song from 1920 or 2007, by songs from neo traditionalists like Doc Watson, Steve Earle or Alvin Youngblood, as well as by a futuristic track by Coltrane, Björk or Robert Wyatt (i choosed on purpose people from different eras).
rock is not a scientist's lab
r&b is not r&d

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

FINAL FOUR
1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” – Hearing it in the trailer for Todd Haynes’ Dylan quasi-biopic I’M NOT THERE (can’t wait) just reiterated again that it fully deserves its #1 ranking on AM, and fully deserves to win this tournament. Is it the greatest song ever written or recorded? There’s no such thing. But its impact and influence are immeasurable, and unlike a lot of historically significant artworks it retains all its original potency today. The second you hear that rifle-crack snare, followed instantly by that swirling organ and plinking piano and overdriven rhythm guitar, just try to resist the need to listen to it all the way through even if you’ve heard it 10,000 times. You can’t. THAT’s how it feels.
2. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter” – Dylan insisted to Mr. Jones that something was happening even if he didn’t know what it was. This record is what he was talking about. In every facet of this song, you can -feel- the fire and everything that image represents sweeping inexorably down the street, engulfing everything in its path. Love may be just a kiss away, as Mick and Merry sing at the end, but listening to the song you sense that it’s merely a transitory calm before the gathering storm. To quote NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN: You can’t stop what’s coming.
3. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” – I keep coming back to the bridge, that wondrous section in which a wordless Lennon and a majestic orchestra segue us back into the main existential body of the song after McCartney’s intentionally humdrum-by-comparison workaday digression. You couldn’t ask for a more succinct example of the differences between the two men: Paul’s focus on the immediate details and small pleasures of the day vs. John’s impressionistic grappling with The Big Questions. You can analyze Lennon’s images all you want; his voice on that bridge, simultaneously conveying anomie and agony, tells you everything you need to know.
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” – Anyone who ever accused Jackson of being a mere purveyor of pop fluff never -really- listened to this intensely psychodramatic slice-of-inner-life, which proves that the KoP was a raging paranoid long before any of the scandals came to light. It’s a dark piece of work (those weirdly undermixed and echoey vocal interjections – “Do think twice! Ah-HOO!” – can haunt your dreams) that, thanks to Jackson and Quincy Jones (frequently overrated, but actually kind of underrated here if you think about it), becomes an irresistible, brilliantly arranged and produced blockbuster hit single. That said, it’s still out of its league in this group.

This has been a lot of fun. Thanks, Schleuse!

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

I can't wait for I'm Not There either. Release is something like April in the Netherlands though..

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” - They have so many great songs, but this is really one of their best.
2. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” - The song fascinates me from begin to end, great music and great lyrics.
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter” - One of the best of them, together with Sympathy for the Devil, which I would place 3rd to in this bracket, would it be in.
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” - this was an easy choice, although this is also fantastic.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

My own personal bracketology was just way too hard, so I quit at the sweet sixteen. I know it's a cop out.

FINAL FOUR
1. Bob Dylan, “Like a Rolling Stone” - Was edged out by "Superstition" in the second round, but definitely one of my top 20 songs, which is a little more than I can say for the rest.
2. The Beatles, “A Day in the Life” - Cliff Notes for "Sgt. Pepper's." Encapsulates the music and experimentalism of that album into one song. A top 100 track for me.
3. The Rolling Stones, “Gimme Shelter” - Packs a wallop alright, and to me it's their conclusion of the dark trilogy of songs, which includes "Paint It Black" and "Sympathy for the Devil." Another top 100 song.
4. Michael Jackson, “Billie Jean” - I wasn't too surprised when this song made it out of the first round, but when it kept moving on, I was shocked. I like it, probably top 200, but top four??????? No way.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

1. A Day in the Life - Everytime I think about this song and all aspects of it, it's hard to describe how essential it is to my musical understanding.

a) It is the final song on an album. Most final songs have sort of an epic sense of closure to them and this song provides a nearly perfect ending.

b) It is the final song of Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band. The sweep of lush styles of this conceptual album must have been pretty amazing to behold when it first emerged on listener's ears. To appreciate this song, you have to understand the album's sequence, that this song began after the "show" of the album had ended, sneaking in after the closing applause. Conceptually, it puts me at a very interesting place.

c) It is by the Beatles. To think the creators of She Loves You and I Want to Hold Your Hand produced this in a short few years is difficult to comprehend. After this song their next career moves could not be close to predicted.

d) It epitomizes boundaries-free musical expression. I'd like to think that if I was lucky enough to make oodles of money and then had the freedom to simply 'create' with no restrictions based on marketability or popularity placed on, what would emerge in any artistic medium would be something this song represents.

e) It aurally represents a irreversible shift in what constitutes popular music. No words can tangibly describe what the massive orchestral crescendo and final drawn out chord mean. You can just imagine Lennon and McCartney taking you with your ears to the ends of the Earth, and through that final note blowing up any musical legacy they held built up to that point and creating everything they do in the future completely on my their own terms.

In other words, not my individual favorite song of all time (that's a more personal choice) but the only song of these four that really truly matters.


2. Gimme Shelter - that being said, this song has been played more on my computer playlist than A Day In the Life. I don't even have the album it's from, but it has been a pervasive soundtrack for dark and creeping menace for multiple generations now, and is the perfect encapsulation of the Stones sound and the key representation of the counterpoint to what their rock godfather rivals the Beatles were doing.

3. Like a Rolling Stone - I am sorry to admit that appreciating lyrics are not my strong point, and can say without a doubt that lyrically A Day in the Life is the absolute worst of this bunch. I can totally understand how this song is the best combination of lyrics and music ever recorded, but I'll let the true Dylan fans express their love for this song.

4. Billie Jean - Because it made it this far, I will definitely give the song more attention, but before its Final 4 status I probably would have skipped over this song on the radio.

Re: Bracketology: The Final Four

In my list of the top songs of all time (last time we did it), I had

A Day in the Life #6
Billie Jean #11
Like a Rolling Stone #51
Gimme Shelter #101

Thus, I'm really happy about the final four. Here, at the beginning of the writing, I'm still sure that Beatles and MJ will take the top positions (in my personal rank that is, I am well aware that "Billie" is #4 in almost every other ballot, which raises the question: how did it get here?). But now to the difficult question: should "groundbreaking pop" go before "perfect pop"? Well, I might admire "A Day in the Life" a little more, but "Billie Jean" is when I HAVE TO go to the stereo and turn up the volume. Well, I decided to go with

1. A Day in the Life
2. Billie Jean

Why? Well, "A Day in the Life" is perfect pop too, although in a very different way than "Billie Jean".

Both "Like a Rolling Stone" and "Gimme Shelter" are for me outstanding song by Stones and Dylan. Still, I had "Like a Rolling Stone" on that all-time list out of respect rather than personal feelings. That's not the case for "Gimme Shelter", so I'm doing the unthinkable here and put Dylan at fourth place.

3. Gimme Shelter
4. Like a Rolling Stone