A brand new book lists top 100 Canadian albums as chosen by hundreds of musicians, critics, etc.
No New Pornographers
See it here:
http://www.canada.com/globaltv/globalshows/et_story.html?id=981a7cd4-4a31-4c0a-a024-0ffd50445df4

Well no surprises with the top 3 or 4 - I was wondering if Arcade Fire would crash the top 10,good to see them up the list. I forgot how much great music has come from Canada...

Might have to check out the Tragically Hip.

Top notch them be. It's bar-rock with awesome song-writing and literate lyrics. Fully Completely has had at least 7 singles on regular rotation in Canada since it was released 15 years ago.

Good to see Bruce Cockburn get some credit (I would personally rank "Humans" almost as high as "Dancing in the Dragon's Jaws", and possibly "Salt, Sun and Time" and his first live album "Circles in the Stream" even higher).

Cowboy Junkies too!!

And the reviewer's inclusion of Ronnie Hawkins in his personal top 10 gets my backing too.

Sorry everyone, please forgive my fellow Canadian jonmarck for his unfortunate leanings toward bad music from north of the 49th.

While he's correct in noting that "The Hip" (as it were) "...had at least 7 singles on regular rotation in Canada since it was released 15 years ago...", he has failed to mention that up here in our great country there is an unfortunate little thing called CanCon, a cutesy abbreviation for Canadian Content - a policy whereby 30 (or 35) percent of each radio station's playlist must be music from a Canadian artist/producer/writer.

Ergo, as you can probably imagine, a lot of truly terrible songs manage to make their way onto Canadian radio each year as a result of CanCon. Hey, they have to meet the quota somehow. Some artists can even thank CanCon for their moderately successful (and unfortunate) careers. The Tragically Hip being one of them.

Anthony without Cancon the Canadian music industry would not exist. Ergo that entire list would have to be whittled down to no more than ten names. It's no coincidence that it was when Cancon was put in place in the 70's that Canadian music took a worldwide stage via Rush, Guess Who, etc. If they had ever gotten rid of it while radio was still popular the industry would have fallen apart.

Beside being incredible songwriters the Tragically Hip happen to be the most grounded successful rock band ever. There are no egos, no attempts or pretensions to vast amounts of fame or credibility and they always take every opportunity to support the country that gave them life. Most of the reason why they never broke in other countries is because they simply weren't interested. In an industry where everyone's always breaking up their band and going solo and backstabbing each other not only have the Hip stayed together, still releasing hit albums decades into their career, no one's even questioned their cohesion. And the situation is not as Anthony suggests, where an entire nation's radio is held hostage to the whims of socialist legislature. Most often the really popular groups that get huge requests ARE Canadian. I remember the late 90's when groups like I Mother Earth, Our Lady Peace, Sloan, Treble Charger and Matt Good Band were all going strong. Hell, even Nickleback, Avril Lavigne and Sum 41 are Canadian. You had to convince the programmers to play something that WASN'T Canadian. It was even more fortunate for the station because these artists might possibly even care about THEM. They might tour through the city, Canadian stations would be first on their list for new material, and, God forbid, they might even drop by for an interview.

I'm really sick of hearing Canadians bash their music scene, especially since most of them just talk bullsh!t. Put 100 Canadian bands up against 100 American bands, the Canadians will always win. This isn't just me talking, it's widely accepted. Most chalk it up to the fact that we spend half the year indoors, have strong arts classes in high schools and have a much more socialist view towards the arts. So why haven't we made a dent on the worldwide stage? WE HAVE! Look at the list! For a country as sparsely populated as ours that's pretty amazing! (Even more amazing when you talk about the list of Canadian comedians.) AND IT WOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED WITHOUT CANCON! That's NOT an exaggeration!!! It's not a coincidence that Neil Young, Gordon Lightfoot, Joni Mitchell and the Band all had to move OUT of Canada to get famous! But there are other problems that Canadians face too. It's ridiculously difficult to tour Canada due to the long, hard drives between markets (and Lord help you if you try to tour in the winter) and it was difficult to get a work visa to tour the States BEFORE 9/11. Now it's near impossible. Also there's always the jackasses who slag their country just because it's their country.

I'm not anti Canadian music; I'm anti-Tragically Hip. I'm not buying the whole "not interested in breaking in the US" or anywhere else for that matter. No band in the world would aspire to only have success in their home country - that's a ridiculous claim. "Success in the US? Sorry, not interested." Yeah right. The fact of the matter is, if they were of any quality, they would've had success in places other than Canada. Most Canadians have latched onto The Hip because of the perpetuated notion that they somehow represent Canadians values, and to not like them is to not be a patriotic Canadian. I praise the music fans and critics in the US or wherever that have listened with an objective ear and said "no thanks" to a band that sings about things like brutally cold winters and horse sh!t. "The tone and content of much of their music is a paean to the Canadian experience and touches on such themes as small-town life, geography, Canadian history and hockey." (wikipedia) Want some deep and touching lyrics of a universal nature? Best look elsewhere.

And regarding CanCon, when you're forced to play a certain percentage of anything, some utter crap is bound to enter the picture. And sometimes familiarity breeds popularity; you hear something on the radio enough and you may start to like it, despite the fact that it's the furthest thing from being any good.

You're talking about radio. Utter crap IS ALWAYS THE PICTURE! AND MOST OF IT COMES FROM SOUTH OF THE BORDER! Going back to the late 90's while we reveled in our Cancon they were pushing Blink 182, Creed and Limp Bizkit. Are you trying to tell me that the cruel Cancon regulations didn't let you listen to enough Creed?

Believe it or not global domination is not EVERYONE'S prime objective. I thank the stars for groups like the Hip who have no qualms about staying middle-class (though, of course, all 5 of them are stinkin' rich). And to say that the group doesn't have fans outside of Canada is a plain lie. They enjoy cult status in many countries around the world, Holland for example. Most Tragically Hip tours sell well in the Northern States and Europe.

And, yes, there are short-sighted critics who have no understanding of context and use the 30 mins they give the group to rule them off as bland blues-rock, but those who understand the importance of a band who loves their country enough to support what makes it unique (such as Road Apples, the Toronto Maple Leafs and Hugh MacLennan) can't say enough about them. This band was one of the ways that Canadian culture got out from under the thumb of the States. They're one of the reasons why Canadians stopped thinking of themselves as America Jr. They are so intrinsic to Canadian culture that any discussion on the topic quickly brings up their name. They're also the most important Canadian musicians to live IN CANADA. Hell, when I lived in Kingston I saw Rob Baker every weekend. He even came to our bar with his posse for lunch. Sum 41, Celine Dion and Billy Talent are so desperate to get out of Canada for the glittering promise of success in LA. I'm thrilled to see a group that takes value in more substantial gains.

No, I’m trying to tell you that the cruel Cancon regulations are responsible for a lot of lousy bands and music from Canada. Our country’s population is a tenth of the US, yet our radio stations have to play one Canadian song in every three songs they play. The math doesn’t add up, and it results in a lot of mediocre music being heard over the airwaves.

Back to the The Tragically Sh!t...

Global domination might not be everyone’s prime objective, but you can sure as hell bet that any aspiring band or singer/songwriter would want their music to be heard by as many people as possible. No one writes songs with the hope that only x number of people hear them! The Hip might be a “cult” band in places other than Canada, but why aren’t they huge? Seems to me that you’re embarrassed to admit that, by and large, music fans in the US might be smarter than Canadians when it comes to matters such as The Hip. They certainly haven’t embraced the band, but us Canadians are too damn patriotic and scared to admit what everybody else seems to know already.

we have a similar thing to cancon in australia. sure, australia's music scene doesn't impress me, but i certainly don't see our "AusCon" as a bad thing. first of all, i see it as partially responsible for the success of the small handful of decent australian bands. secondly, it's nice to get a preview of all the bands that i can see live for about a quarter the price of an international act.

the radio station that i listen to actually limits themselves to australian music more than they are required to. they play 50% australian music, and 50% of that is from sydney. in my opinion, they play less crap than other stations. my point is, if radio stations weren't playing australian crap, they would be playing international crap. yes, with or without "CanCon", radio would still maintain the same percentage of crap.

Wow…this is the second argument we’ve had this year between Edmonton and Toronto about the Tragically Hip, so, as a fellow North American who lives almost as far from Canada as it’s possible to be, I’m going to have a listen.

I just ordered Fully Completely from a Texas dealer on amazon. It’s not in print in the US…perhaps someone can explain to me why the oop prices range from $10 to $600.

Anthony, take away Cancon and you'll be taking away the Arcade Fire, Broken Social Scene, Ron Sexsmith, Metric, Weakerthans, Feist and every other name you see on that list. The connection is really THAT direct. These are all bands/artists that relied heavily on government arts programs such as Cancon, Factor, VideoFact and CBC Radio to survive through the fragile early stages. It's not that they weren't more talented than American music, it's that they didn't have the shouting power that US labels have. It's hard enough to break a new band in Canada as it is (used to be, I'm speaking from a time before radio lost its listeners and internet promotion was still in development) without having to compete with overproduced bullsh!t like Staind and Green Day that the less tasteful of listeners seem to latch onto. As a campus radio volunteer I often see the direct result of how the Cancon regulations force DJ's to get to know Canadian bands they would have otherwise passed by in favour of a US or British group they already know. Take away Cancon and no one will care about Canadian music any more. It really is that direct. Take a look at that list and see how many of those groups you can live without, because that's what you're proposing. You're saying you like babies but can't stand pregnant women. You can't have one without the other!

As for the Hip, what you've described so far is an entire nation in denial; brainwashed by radio stations so compelled to play Cancon that The Tragically Hip have become dictators of the music scene. Your entire criticism of their music so far has been if they were good they would be famous outside of Canada. As short-sighted as that is it also reveals a depressingly low national self esteem. Who CARES if they're almost exclusively a Canadian band? They don't, they've made very little effort since the early 90's to break in other markets. Sure, they'll take more listeners if more are available, but they're not going to force it. When you've got an entire nation of 35 million doting on you why kill yourself for a few half-hearted peripheral fans? Besides, the Hip mainly works within the Canadian context. If you don't care about things like The Trailer Park Boys or The Toronto Maple Leafs chances are most of The Tragically Hip will go tragically above your head, like it did for so many uneducated US critics. They're not Canadiana because Canadians love them, they're Canadiana because they love Canada, and those who don't know Canada just won't see what the big fuss is about.

The passionate (and practical) music fan in me wants to advise you against listening to it, not only to spare yourself the torture that is bad Canadian rock music, but also to save you from wasting your time.

But as a mature and responsible music fan, I will say that you have every right to listen and formulate your own opinion. You may even like what Downie and co. have to offer (which is still incomprehensible to me, but I digress…)

Regarding the price discrepancies, I can’t imagine why anyone in their right mind would part with $600 for that load of shite. Must be a typo.

I'd love to hear what you think Schleuse and I think you answered your own question. It's got such a range because Canada's the only country where it's in print and since different dealers have different distribution deals it's really difficult for some of them to get a copy.

The tracks that get main attention on Fully Completely are:
Courage - A radio staple dedicated to Canadian nationalist author Hugh MacLennan. This is one of the most easily recognized tracks from the album.
Looking for a Place to Happen - A simple bar-rock riff that follows the career-long theme of isolation and making your own fun.
At the Hundredth Meridian - A stomper with a killer build up in the bridge. Another radio staple.
Locked in the Trunk of a Car - The slow burner. This one took a while for me to get into but when I saw them perform it in Kingston (right up to the "Let me out" ending) it stole the show. It's generally a fan favourite and if you were ever looking for the reason why I call them the Canadian R.E.M. this one hits the same notes as Losing My Religion. Of course LITTOAC blows the stale, passion-less, pretentious LMR out of the water.
Fifty Mission Cap - Another radio staple, the lyrics are comprised first of reading off of the back of a hockey card, then explaining that the lyrics were read off the back of a hockey card, then repeated. Despite its humble subject matter its still one of the most compelling rockers on the album.
Fully Completely - Blues-rock tune with great lyrics that flow based on their poetic connotations rather than their direct interpretation.
Wheat Kings - The Hip get back to rural roots with slide guitars and more Canadiana references ("Paris of the Prairies" which also references how thoroughly Canadians define their lives by other cultures, "pictures of prime ministers", "CBC radio"). But the main reason why fans love this song is the same reason for why they love the Hip. The inmate in the story is David Milgaard, wrongfully convicted of murder in the 1960's. So often the Hip go out of their way to unearth buried dramas that the rest of the world deemed un-newsworthy, and Milgaard's story is one tragedy to which they bring light. Inmates are also a common theme in Tragically Hip songs. Not surprising seeing as how they came from the home of Canadian penitentiaries, Kingston. That's the great thing about the Hip. There is no story too small or common to write about. They see the beauty in simple things like "cold winters and cowshit", even if it costs them the acclaim of pettier, more ADD listeners.
The Wherewithal - It's a sweaty 2 minute rocker, a pleasant finish to their famous live album, "Live Between Us".

Rob Baker, with his long hair, beard and blues riffs, presents the laid-back, small-town image of the band but the real star is Downie with his observational, metaphor-laden lyrics. You'll never hear lines like his again. He's a maniac live too. His performances are a stream of conscious, often improvising over sections written as instrumentals. Check out youtube videos of That Night in Toronto to see what I mean. It's a band with more cohesion than recordings are capable of replicating.

Sorry jonmarck – didn’t see your post.

You make a good argument for CanCon; I’m willing to leave it at that.

I’m not claiming that Canada is in denial…. well, maybe I am. It just seems that there is a perpetuating idea that everyone has to like the band, because they are so intrinsically Canadian, and if you don’t you’re not a true Canadian. Almost like it’s sacrilege to NOT like them – the equivalent of burning the flag.

In terms of instrumental prowess, they’re a talented band, no question. But a truly great band should be able to work on a universal context – one that doesn’t require a fan to be a citizen of the band’s home country in order to “get” their music.

While we're on the subject of Canadian rock, jonmarck, what are your thoughts/feelings about Matthew Good? Own any of his records and/or seen him live?

Interesting discussion. I'm gonna follow schleuse and get that album to see what the fuss is all about.

Alanis Morrissette is far too high up that list!

I used to be a reasonably keen Matt Good Band fan but once he split off I lost interest. It seems like songwriting took a dive at that point, and it wasn't ever really the focus to begin with. I've just never bought HIM really. He's more preacher than musician, and some of his views are just an extra shallow, arrogant version of the Colbert Report. When he's rocking he's great, it's when he drifts into whiny ballad mode that I lose interest. Beautiful Midnight has some great moments though.

Oh, and I have Beautiful Midnight and have seen him twice as a solo act. Both performances were overstuffed with slow acoustic jams and vocables.

Interesting discussion about The Hip. Well, here in Europe it is 'easy' to get their music. I bought Fully Completely (in Göteborg, Sweden!) shortly after its release and it has become my favourite Hip album. I also like the earlier albums Road Apples and Up To Here, the albums released after Fully Completely I'm not so fond of.

Summarizing, with or without CanCon I can recommend Fully Completely.

I like the fact that they've put a lot of newer albums high up on the list, rather than some of these lists which don't list anything after 1979 except for ac couple stuck near the end.

Harvest is great, but Songs of Leonard Cohen is my personal fave, and surprised no GY!BE or Boards of Canada

I've listened to Fully Completely two times now, and I must say my opinion lies somewhere in the middle of Anthony and jonmarck's opinions. (Yes, very political, I know.. but it's honestly so)

They're a decent group, and I even found a few songs quite good, but they're not extraordinary. Still, pretty good album.

I have to admit I was expecting that reaction. The truth is (aside from the great lyrics and song-writing, which a LOT of artists have) the band is only exceptional in their enforcement of Canadian values. They're still a great band and Fully Completely deserves it's recognition, but I think most of its charms are accessible only to habitants this country. In a lot of ways they are the local heroes.

Further reading (and excellent reading at that):

http://www.edge.ca/station/ongoing_history_of_new_music.cfm?rem=8974&pge=1&arc=2

This is a transcript of part 1 segment 1 of a 2 part 90 minute radio broadcast. The other segments can be accessed by clicking the "back" link at the bottom of the page and scrolling down to "The Tragically Hip". It goes as far as anyone can to explain why we like the Hip so much, though just reading their contract rider at the bottom of the first segment should be sufficient!

Sorry, third post in a row.

Here's the segment that explains both Fully Completely and why the Hip are seen as exclusively Canadian. Forgive the writer for his optimism in the band's American viability. This was written and broadcast in 1994 or 95, when the Hip were just coming off their creative peak. Though it has its share of gems ("Gift Shop" was what initially got me into the Hip), Trouble in the Henhouse was the first of a series of disappointing albums. The first four, the live album and the most recent, "World Container", are the only Hip albums that I'd recommend.

Sorry, HERE's the segment: http://www.edge.ca/station/ongoing_history_of_new_music.cfm?rem=8975&pge=1&arc=2

Hey, where's damosuzuki in all of this madness? He's Canadian, and I'd love to hear his two cents on The Hip. Mr. Suzuki, where are you?

Anthony - I kinda decided to avoid this topic because I have some pretty strong views on cancon regulations and I try to avoid getting into political debates on message boards these days. It's bad for my blood pressure, I suspect.

I'll happily chime in on the hip, though - I don't like them! I find their music grey, plodding and dreary. I can't really add anything more profound than that, I guess.