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only 15 female artist in the top 200

top Females would be then (200):

1: Aretha Franklin...(WTF)
2: Joni Mittchel
3: Pj Harvey (??)
4: Björk (?)
5: Madonna (?????????)
6: Patti Smith (or Fleetwood mac if you count them as a female band)
7: Janis Joplin (Blondie/Pretenders, if u count them as a female band)
8: Missy Elliot (?????)
9: Kate Bush
10: Dusty Springfield (Chic if u count them as a femake band)
11: Carole King
12: The Supremes (diana ross is somewhere in the 700's)
13: Sinead O Connor (u know, the bald girl with that 1 hitsingle)
14: Donna Summer (should be a lot higher) (ike and tina doesn't count,as Tina is in the 300's)
15: abba, although not a female group...

so breaking down that list a bit... it takes a man to be a good muscician/artist :)

Yep...

it's a man's world- the music industry isn't any different, especially when it comes to the music that receives the most acclaim. There was a good article on this matter online, published by some Women in Music organization.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

It's a travesty that female acts are so poorly represented. All of the ones in the Acclaimed Music top 200 belong though.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

Men are better at specialising in things. Look at the top chefs, the top clothing designers, etc etc. A lot of it is genetic - the female and male brains are slightly different.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

I think it has to do with two things.

1. Rock music was not an area for women at the beginning. Were there any girl rock bands before the 80s? They're catching up slowly though.

2. Men are much more interested in lists (just look at this forum!!!), and therefore the percentage of female votes is even smaller than the small percentage of female critics.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

I agree with you, Henrik. Men are much more interested in lists. But the representation of music made by women in this list (and any list) is improving. You could look, by example, at the best albums of 1993, with “Debut”, “Exile in Guyville”, “Rid of Me” and “Last Splash” on top of the list. Anyway, a list of songs and albums don’t need to be politically correct, is not a congress or a chamber of representatives. These lists are about music, I mean about tastes, about feelings, about fun, anger, sadness…

Anyway I’d like to introduce a new point for the debate (well, Michael S. is pointing in the same direction in a very recent post). I’ve read a lot of comments about the bias of music critics respect to women music and black music. But I haven’t read anything about the main subject of injustice of any list in general (and this in particular): the ethnocentrism of English-speaking countries. Obviously, English is the tongue to use for communication all around the world (just look at this forum and the controversy around a previous post by Yaron). And, of course, the USA and UK built styles like pop, rock, soul, jazz or hip-hop. But to consider that no song is a good song unless it is sung in English is a quite different affair.
You must go down to the 208 number to find the first song in a non-english tongue (“Autobahn” by Kraftwerk, and usually Kraftwerk released English versions of the albums). Next is “Je t’aime (moi non plus)” in number 394. And nothing more in the first 1000 (except two more songs by Kraftwerk: “Das Model” in 863 and “Trans-Europa Express” in 865). In the albums list, except the albums by Kraftwerk and “Moon Safari” (mostly sung in English), only “Agaetis Byrjun” (#438), “Histoire de Melody Nelson” (#493) and “Monarchie und Alltag” (#716) made the top 1000.
I know that world music is not included in these lists and that’s the main reason for this situation. But when I hear people complaining about black music being biased by music critics I think they are probably right, but it’s true that reaching a massive audience is far easier for an African-american musician that for a white European musician who choose his native tongue to sing. Of course most of my favourite albums and songs are in acclaimed music lists and (again) this is not a chamber of representatives, but let me post two questions:
1º Is it fair that two Caribbean islands with a lot of black population and with very influential and very rich musical traditions, Cuba and Jamaica, are so differently represented in these lists, with 4 Jamaican albums in the Top 200 an none from Cuba in the Top 2000?
2º If Franz Ferdinand were not from Scotland and were from Netherlands, by example, with exactly the same personnel and the same songs but singing in dutch, could “Nemt u mij uit” (dutch for “Take Me Out”, courtesy of ets.freetranslation.com) have reached the number one of acclaimed music lists?

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

Honorio - That's a great (and relevant) point. U.S. critics, and even moreso the public, are very ignorant when it comes to music not sung in English. The general point, though, is that critics - like all people - have cetain biases, so all lists and compilations of lists shouldn't be taken as fact.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

Great post, Honorio.

Although I would like to see more non-english recordings, I think it is quite natural that the critics do not list (or even listen to) music they do not understand the lyrics of. It is not a coincidence that the find the first two songs in a non-english tongue are Autobahn and Je t’aime (moi non plus). Their "sounds" are quite self-explanatory...

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

Well, you're right both. But keep in mind also that the level of English in Spanish population is veeery low (not comparable with North Europe), so almost everyone in Spain doesn't understand neither a word of its favorite bands.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

I agree with Honorio. I think in most cases one needn't understand the lyrics to enjoy the music. Not knowing Icelandic never stopped me from liking Sigur Ros, for instance. It might be different with hip-hop artists and literary singer-songwriters, who rely heavily on their words, though.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

I think Sleater-Kinney should definitely be in the top 200, or even the top 100 really. But then again, they're in my personal top 10.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

Excellent! Sleater-Kinney are definitely among the greatest bands of the moment -- they would be totally revered if they were all male.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

While I agree that the bias is there, I think it would be hard to break. While I sometimes can appreciate music in languages I don't speak (I like some of Cesaria Evora's music for instance) for the most part I make more of an emotional "connection" when I can understand the lyrics.

Which means a bias against non-English lyrics for the most part.

My dislike of opera stems to some degree from that though I think I might dislike it even if sung in English because of the melodramatic performances.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

I think I like opera better than I otherwise would because I don't understand the words.

Re: only 15 female artist in the top 200

This years been terrible for female performers. There's finally a lot of female solo singers but most of them blow. The brits are all Amy Whinehouse followers and than you have Katy Perry. "I Kissed a Girl" being sung by a women was clever when it was done in the 90s. Jill Sobule's lyrics were pretty witty so to have someone use the exact name and concept only watered down is pretty tacky. Our local top 40 Alternative rock stations are always missing women on their playlist but when they actually play women they play crap like Katey Perry, Evanessance and Paramoure. Women that try to sound like the trendy cockrockers dominating their playlist.