Go to the NEW FORUM
It is fair to say that the history of women in pop music can be divided into before... and after... Madonna. Most of the reasons she garnered so much attention is because of things she did in her work- gender, racial, religious, sexual and social mores in her music, stage shows, videos, etc. She definitely used music as a means for other goals, no doubt about that- and image was about as important as the music at times- but that doesn't negate that the music has been pretty darn great, overall.
What's interesting in this is that as respected and highly regarded as Joni is, she was not a first-year-eligible inductee into the Rock Hall of Fame- among females, only Janis Joplin and Madonna have made it in in their first year of eligibility. Aretha Franklin made it in in the Hall's second year ()she was eligible in the first year).
AM uses old-fashioned html code and frames and you need to delete cached internet files. The best thing is to go into tools somewhere and delete all files. Alternatively you have to right-click on a particular frame and choose refresh frame.
Well, don't expect to hear anything from me before Christmas; I'm going to need at least that much time to update my iTunes to reflect the new list.
I can't wait.
Great update particularly fascinting to see how the decade lists affected everything the rankings over the past few years. Particularly noteworthy that the top songs were Hip-hop flavoured as it pretty m,uch towered over the last 10 years. Two queries:
1. Did any songs drop out of the AM 3000 + bubbling under from this update?
2. Hervé Bourhis (France) - Le Petit Livre Rock: The Juke Box Singles 1950-2009. If this is included in the year end lists, could that also be the case for Dave Marsh's top40 per year 1954- 1981?
Only yesterday I told a friend of mine about Acclaimed Music: "It's a great site, too bad it's no longer updated." Way to make me look like a fool! Well done, Henrik.
Do you still maintain links to old AM pages to compare previous rankings??
Including bubbling under tracks, I noticed that there are 4,879 songs on the spreadsheet.
Do you think that you would ever expand the Top 3000 to a Top 4000 or 5000?
By the way, I forgot to mention...
Thanks for the update, Henrik! You certainly put a lot of hard work into this every time! :D
Acclaimed Music is hands-down the website I get most excited about to see updates to!
With the new entries and the songs that fell off the 3000 lists, the bubbling under section grew up to 1879 songs. Almost a list for itself now
Many thanks for the update, Henrik!
Thanks for this update, Henrik! It sure has been a hard work for you.
Of all the things to love and hate about the new update, I think these three make me the most happy:
1- Sunday Bloody Sunday in the top 200 (closing in on One)
2- Hallelujah in the top 1000
3- Juicy in the top 1000
Of all the negatives, I'm the most saddened by the fall of All Along the Watchtower out of hte top 100
I can understand why people would think Hey Ya! is too high. But with it up to 19th, every decade from the 1950s on is represented in the top 20, which I think is definitely a good thing.
Thanks a lot for the outstanding job Henrik!
"Hey Ya!" is a little overhyped, still, it's great, but not Outkast's best, if "Ms. Jackson" was on the Top 100 I think it would be more deserving. Also, sad to see that the songs from "In Utero" have dropped down so much (funny thing that "Smells Like Teen Spirit" ain't even Nirvana's best song and now it's #3 of all time-sure it's awesome and full of energy and probably sums up the whole grunge movement but in terms of sound it lacks the complexity of, say, "Come As You Are" or the pure darkness of "Heart Shaped Box"),
I pray that this "Louie Louie" song someday will leave the Top 100 for good... even the Top 200. "Get Ur Freak On" too. "Crazy In Love" is catchy, but above "Light My Fire"? Or "Walk On The Wild Side"? Or "Layla"? Waaaaaay too much. It's also a shame to see "All Along The Watchtower", "Live Forever" and "Little Red Corvette" out of the Top 100 now. Critics...
Lady Gaga's an exception. She uses wacky makeup and costumes so people don't notice she's not attractive. Plus she capitalized on social networking and benefited a lot from the 'Kanye effect'.
But, Madonna's hardly to blame for that, you can't place all the fault for the way MTV changed the music industry on one woman who happened to be a central figure in MTV's early days.
I don't know to what extent she is creatively involved in her music, but it's probably more than most pop singers and a whole lot less than Joni.
Joni Mitchell's great but she can also be a bit self righteous. One of those people who will rail against capitalism but can't live without the comfort it provides.
^ Great post, HRS. Sorry to dumb things down...
Hmmm... In the real world Madonna totally would've won that fight.
Nah, I's a cool video!
Also: ignore the 'Is Every' before Laura Nyro haha and another thing: female fronted groups like Cocteau Twins, Sleater-Kinney The United States of America and Broadcast also have their credit due. Portishead, Blondie at least are exceptions that are going pretty well!
I'm no feminist - of course - i don't want to say that comparisons and fight among men don't happen - they sure do and they sure get nasty on press, too. It's just a fact that many women are underrated. I'm not a fan of the idea that women need to support each other more, since that ended up giving us lilith fair but they sure need to know how to deal with the press better. They're not Joni Mitchell.
Her Madgesty didn't fare GREAT on the decade-end lists, so that could have influenced the slight drop in rank (a couple of tracks will see more weight for that French jukebox list, though, which will be moved to the all-time section, but that shouldn't result in a dramatic jump).
HRS, the way you feel about Joni is how I feel about Madonna. And I respect that. :) I became as big a fan as a I am not only because I thoroughly enjoyed the musical work, but also because I was fascinated that a mainstream pop star was doing what she was doing, tackling all sorts of cultural issues, going as far as she was, and giving our culture and society important topics of discussion. All the books/essays devoted to analyzing and dissecting the music, videos, concerts, etc.- it reeled me in to look further into this woman (I was around 14 when I really started delving into her).
One thing that Joni and Madonna have in common- aside from a large level of acclaim- is that they are not afraid to speak their mind. When Joni made the comment, Madonna's spokeswoman responded with this:
“Wow. What can I say? Madonna has always been a huge fan of Joni Mitchell’s. I don’t know what to say. I’m sorry she feels that way. Madonna speaks frequently about her admiration and worship of Joni’s talent. Wow. The feeling isn’t mutual.”
Madge shouldn't feel bad- Joni's dissed some very acclaimed and well-regarded acts, it looks.