After my lengthy conversation with an Indian seller of crap pillion seats, last week I had another interesting discussion. This time I was speaking with our good old friend Mark Donald. See also here and here and here ...

This is the discussion:

Hello,

Just want to let you know that I have , bsa parts , if you are interested, email me back for more details.

Thanks.


What is the year of your bike

Immediately followed by:

Hi,

Here ,I attached the picture of my bsa m20 . I`m breaking the complete for parts , because of my surgery that is coming up soon . I want you to send me the list of parts that you need , along with your exact delivery address to know , how close you are to me .

God Bless.

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

A quick Google Image search showed that this bike had been on eBay many years ago, and the picture is now also on Pinterest.


My reaction:

Hi Mark,

Good to hear from you!

It’s a bit of a shame to break up that beautiful bike isn’t it… The fact is that my project is missing so many parts that I consider buying a complete bike. My father passed away a month ago, and he left me a considerable sum of money. So to make a long story short: how much did you have in mind for the complete motorcycle?

I live in a remote part of Canada (Alberta), and my next door neighbour buys and sells cars over the internet. He uses UPS. How much would it cost to send me this bike with UPS to Alberta, Canada please?

Regards,
John

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Mark’s reaction:

Great , the complete bike will cost you $2,100 . Then shipping to your door step in Canada (Alberta) will cost you $480 . As soon as you pay for it now , my agent will come get the bike and package it for shipping immediately .

Regarding payment , I`II accept bank to bank transfer , as soon as I get your interest now , I`II send you my daughter banking details for the funds transfer .

My address is , 460 s,old Blvd Apt 314 Fairless Hills ,Pa 19030 USA.

Very sorry for the lost of your dad . Let me also have the address where you want my agent to ship the bike to .

Thanks .

Mark.

My reaction:

Hi Mark,

Thanks for your reply! Well, that’s a suspiciously cheap bike, what’s wrong with it? Does it come with paperwork? Is the engine running? Is the bike in the USA?

Regards,
John

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Mark’s reaction:

The bike is in Pennsylvania , the bike is cheap because I need to sell the bike on time to be able to undergo my surgery.

The bike have papers , and before you pay for the bike , I'm going to send you copies of the paperwork.

Besides I'm 90 with grand sons and daughters and I have never stolen from any body before not even in my sick bed now.

Hope you understand better now ?

Mark.

My reaction:

Hello Mark,

Sorry to hear about your surgery. And sorry, I really didn’t want to accuse you… It’s just that the price of the bike is suspiciously low. I’d like to believe you, as I’m very interested in this bike, so please convince me!

Regards,
John

Mark’s reaction:

Hi ,

Thanks for your concern over my health problem. I understand your email quite alright, I really need to sell the bike on time because my surgery is due for operation.

I can't steal your money upon my failing health , I'm going to send you the scan copy of the clear title before you transfer the funds into my daughter bank account.

I'm also going to order my lawyer to prepare a bill of sale , where you are going to sign your signatures and I will also sign mine.

So do not doubt me on this , even when the bike is cheap and I know the bike worth more than that , at first I wanted to sell it at $4,500 but it seems slow with the price , so I have to reduce it to $2,100 , because my surgery operation is due .

Except you want to help me by adding any amount to it as a kind gesture , because from the way you sound I already know that you are a honest man like me.

As soon as I hear from you now, I will send you the scan copy of the title, bill of sale along with my daughter banking details for the funds transfer.

God bless.

Mark.

My reaction:

Hi Mark,

OK, think I can trust you… I’ll buy the bike, if you show me the paperwork
and some detailed pictures (I hope you understand that I don’t want to buy a
pup…)

Regards,
John

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Mark’s reaction:

As I have told you before , the bike is exactly as it appears in the
pictures , do not doubt me on that , If not for the fact that , I`m
already in the intensive care unit , I would have send more pictures
other than the first pictures I send to you .
I have attached the scan copy of the clear title , As soon as I
received the funds now , I`II send you a copy of the bill of sale .
Regarding payment , below is my agent banking details , transfer the
funds now and send me the scan copy of the payment details .

Name: Carol Meehan

Routing number: 231380104

ACH acct numb: 10700000968846

Account number: 9688460070

Bank name: Citadel Credit Union

Swift code: CITGUS44XXX

Bank address: 75 W Germantown Pike, East Norriton, PA 19401, USA.

Hope to received the scan copy of the payment details .

Mark.

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Easy enough to find a template on Google Images:



For the VIN number no doubt he found inspiration here .

My reaction:

Hello Mark,

You say that “The bike is exactly as it appears in the pictures”… but you’ve only sent me one picture so far! Please send me more, as I really don’t want to buy a pup! I want to see the details, what is wrong and what is missing. Send me these and I’ll pay!

Regards,
John

Mark’s reaction:

Yes , I can`t not get more pictures now because I`m already in the pre surgery center .

My reaction:

Then please ask your daughter to take some pictures! I’m not paying anything before I can see more details, hope you understand…

John

Mark’s reaction:

Okay , have just done that now .

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

And a bit later he sends me this:

Here are more pictures .






Images from an auction in Australia , 10 years ago. Please note that he sent the first picture twice: once as in the above website, once with blurred reg nr.

My reaction:

Thank you very much Mark. But sorry, these are not the pictures that I
wanted to see. Could you please ask your daughter to take pictures of the
frame number, the engine number and the speedometer? I should have told this
before, sorry for that. I promise you that I’ll buy the bike as soon as I’ve
seen these pictures. I’ve already spoken with my bank manager, I just have
to give him a call and he will transfer $ 2.500 to your account. This is
more than you were asking for, but I really feel sorry for you, so I think
this is the least that I can do!

Regards,
John

Mark’s reaction:

Sorry my daughter has gone to work till next weekend , I have attached
the picture of the speedometer . Please if you want to transfer the
money but if you don`t want transfer the money without the picture of
the engine number , no problem but this is the height I can go on this
deal .

God Bless .

Mark.



My reaction:

That’s not the speedometer Mark, it’s the ammeter.

Sorry, your money is only one mouse click away from you, but I really need
pictures of the frame and engine numbers. I really can’t wait to ride this
bike. But if these numbers aren’t clear I will have problems importing the
bike in Canada. Canadian customs are very difficult to deal with. I hope you
will understand that this is an important matter.

As I told you, my bank manager has prepared the deal, I only have to give him
a phone call and he’ll press the button. You can almost smell the money
Mark!

Regards,
John

Mark’s reply:

May be you will keep your money in your pocket because I have already
sent you the title .

My reply:

Hello Mark,

What do you mean? I still hope to buy this motorcycle! To own such a bike has been my dream for many years! Please let me know how to proceed!

Regards,
John

No answer…

Hello Mark,

Hope all is well with you? Are you still in hospital?

Regards,
John

No answer…

Dear spammer,

Just want to let you know that I’m going to send all our correspondence to the cyber crime police, and that I’m going to publish all this on the internet.

Have a nice day,
John

Just wanted to share this with the forum… 😂

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Wonderful stuff, Jan. The lady of the house wanted to know what I was sniggering at ! :laughing:

I suppose some people must fall for it or they wouldn't bother?

Rob

email (option): robmiller11(a)yahoo.co.uk

Different version of an old tune. I’ve encountered this a couple of times although never with so much back and forth. At least the scammer had to work a bit. Common denominator in these scams is low price and urgency in closing transaction. My latest version was dire need for funds hence the cheap price and leaving to work on offshore oil rig and need to close before leaving. A friend of mine was also nearly scammed by a very realistic looking eBay listing.

I noticed that he couldn't spell Pennsylvania on the title. Hehe.

I used to get this response every time I advertised for a spare part......so gave up advertising for spare parts, except on closed Facebook or niche sites.

On November 7th I had the pleasure of receiving an interesting email from Mr Peter Deere. The heading of his email was this link: https://pub37.bravenet.com/forum/static/show.php?usernum=3155626639&frmid=16&msgid=1532065&cmd=show . Just wanted to share our pleasant conversation with you… 😃

Peter Deere:
Hi

I have , BSA M20 parts , if you are interested, email me back for more details.

My reply:
Hi Pete,

Yes, what have you got? Please send me pictures and prices…

John

Peter:
Hi ,

Here is an attached picture of my BSA M20 , which I`m about to break for parts because of my health challenges and my age which is not on my side , I want you to send me the list of parts that you may need along with your location , to allow me know how far you are from me .

God Bless .



With the aid of Google Lens I soon found out where he found this picture. An old auction, with lots of different photographs . Very interesting material for an old school scammer!

Me:
Hi Peter,

Good to hear from you!

It’s a bit of a shame to break up that beautiful bike isn’t it… The fact is that my project is missing so many parts that I consider buying a complete bike. My father passed away a month ago, and he left me a considerable sum of money. So to make a long story short: how much did you have in mind for the complete motorcycle?

I live in a remote part of Canada (Alberta), and my next door neighbour buys and sells cars over the internet. He uses UPS. How much would it cost to send me this bike with UPS to Alberta, Canada please?

Regards,
John

Peter:
Hi Jan,

Sorry for your loss . Well I`m 90 in a wheelchair now waiting to undergo my last surgery so that I can leave the wheelchair to walk again though I can`t ride after my surgery according to my doctor . The complete bike will cost you £3,400 . Then shipping to your doorstep in Alberta will cost you £400 . As soon as you pay for it now , my agent will come get it and package it for delivery immediately .

As soon as I get your interest now , I`II send you more pictures of the bike .

God Bless.

Peter .

Me:
Hi Peter,

Thanks for your reply! Well, I’m definitely interested. But that’s a suspiciously cheap bike, what’s wrong with it? Does it come with paperwork? Is the engine running?

Regards,
John


Peter:
I understand but I have to let the bike go cheaply to you because from your email , I already know that you are an honest man like me and you can as well give my bike a good home , otherwise the bike runs great with nothing to fix on it before riding it . As soon as I get your interest now , I`II send you more pictures . The bike has V5 papers .
Regarding payment , I`II accept bank transfers .

God Bless.

Peter .

Me:
Hello,Peter,

Sorry to hear about your surgery! Wish I could help you!

Yes, I am interested! But before I make a bank transfer to you I’d like to see pictures of the frame and engine numbers, I hope you understand.

Thanks for getting in contact with me!
Regards,
John

Peter:
Okay , here are the pictures you requested . Let me have your doorstep address .

God Bless.

27 Northport Drive Wareham Dorset BH20 UK.

Peter .




Clearly copied from the same auction site…

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Me:
Thank you very much Peter! Unfortunately that’s not the frame number that you sent me, it’s a casting number for the rear lug. You can find the frame number on the front tube, as in the attached photograph. Really looking forward to this bike, it looks lovely. Nice patina! Love it!

Regards,
John



Please note that I also used a picture from the auction site to show where he’s got to look for the frame number! Would he notice…? Apparently not…

Peter:
Sorry I`m trying to see them clearly but not visible .

Me:
Hello Peter,

OK, never mind… One final question… Could you please send me a photograph of the V5 document? Canadian customs can be very difficult… If the V5 document looks good I’ll do the bank transfer.

Regards,
John

Peter:
Okay , I will send the V5 documents as soon as my eldest daughter comes back from work.

My agent will deliver the bike to your doorstep, so don't worries about the Canadian customs.

Peter.

Me:
Hello Peter,

That is fantastic! On which bank account can I do the money transfer please?

Best regards,
John


Peter:
Okay . Regarding payment below is my eldest daughter banking details, transfer the money into the account now and send me the scan copy of the deposit slip for confirmation.

Here are my GBP account details at Wise.

Account holder: Kelly-Ann Nutbeam

Swift/BIC: TRWIGB2LXXX

IBAN: GB36 TRWI 2308 0143 6868 64

Bank name and address: Wise Payments Limited
56 Shoreditch High Street
London
E1 6JJ
United Kingdom

When she comes back from work, I will still send you a copy of the V5 paper.

Hope to receive the payment details soon next.

God bless.

Peter .

Me:
My bank manager has prepared the deal, I only have to give him a phone call and he’ll press the button. You can almost smell the money Peter! 😊

Regards,
John

Peter:
Okay .

The next day:
Me:
Hello Peter,

I hope this email finds you well.

My wife was just asking me… given your well respected age… were you the first owner of this bike? That would be fantastic: finding a "one owner from new” BSA!

Just want to let you know that together with a couple of friends, we will be leaving for a bear hunting weekend in the Rocky Mountains this afternoon. This has become a yearly tradition at Armistice Day (weekend plus bank holiday). I’m telling you this because I will be off-grid for a few days…

Best regards,
John
------
Hi Peter,

Last stop where we have WiFi before the Rocky Mountains. Just wanted to ask you if your daughter has found the V5 document?

Best regards
John


Three days later:

Me:
Hello Peter,

Just got back from the Rocky Mountains. It was a great trip, I shot 2 bears!

Haven’t seen the V5 document yet, did you send it to me?

Best regards,
John

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

No reply… let’s try again:

Me:
Hello Peter,

I’m worried about this silence… Hope all is well with you? Just want to let you know that I’m still seriously interested in your BSA!

Regards,
John

Peter:
Oh , sorry about my silence. I was in the hospital for my pre surgery check up . Your picture reminds me of my young age when I was hunting in my neighbourhood . The bike is still available but my eldest nature of work is delaying the V5, still trying to make her help me scan it and attach it as usual .

God Bless.

Peter .

Me:
hello Peter,

My bankmanager has just called me. He wanted to know if he had to transfer 3.800 Pounds to your account. I asked him to wait, until I’ve seen the V5 document. So please don’t forget…

Best regards,
John

Peter:
Okay great , I`II send it in 30 mins time . Sorry for the little delay .

God Bless.

------

Peter .

Hi Jan,

Sorry for the little delay , as my eldest daughter has to quickly leave work and help me out before going to work again . I have attached a copy of the V5 . Please transfer the money now and send me the scan copy of the payment details for confirmation . As soon as I receive the funds now , My agent will come get the bike and package it for delivery immediately .

God Bless.

Peter .



There are lots of V5 scans on the internet. If you look closely you can see how he cut and pasted the original text before he added the new text, letter per letter. This must have taken him a lot of time indeed…

Me:
Hello Peter,

I have asked my bank manager to do the transfer ASAP. Please let me know when you have received the money.

Kind regards,
John

Peter:
Okay great . But tell your bank manager to send the scan copy of the deposit or payment details to you , so that you can forward it to me asap.

God Bless.

Peter .

Me:
Hello Peter,

My bank manager is going to send you a copy with the details of this transaction. He’s got your email address. He also told me that it takes a couple of days before an international money transfer is completed. Don’t worry, the money is coming. Hope to see the BSA delivered here soon!

Best regards,
John

Peter:
Okay Great.

God bless.

Peter.

Think I’ll stop it here… 😊

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

John Docherty who is advertising for 3HW parts also heard from Peter Deere. It threw me as Pete Deere who founded "Trysupply" here in Bournemouth and who I know, and a regular at Kempton, seemed the obvious seller of parts. Fortunately John was on the ball and saw through his scamming. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

I have played this game before. A couple years ago on Craigslist was a perfect 1966 Matchless G80CS. Her husband died and it needed to be sold very quickly and it was for sale at $1800. It seemed odd that after a week it had not sold. I already have a 1967 G80CS so was in no hurry to purchase another one but was interested. Any request for more pictures and the bikes history resulted in her asking if I wanted the bike or not as lots of other people wanted it. I needed to send the money now! So I finally replied I could be at her house tomorrow with cash in hand to take the bike away. She just needed to give me her address. But immediately she had a family emergency and would not be able to meet me but would let me know when she was back home. She never replied back and the bike disappeared off the internet until a few months later it was back up at $1500. She had forgotten her previous story and the bike was now her son's and he needed money for University.

I placed an advert in Old Bike Mart this year as I am looking to buy a M21 engine and got no replies at all but I did get four replies from people trying to scam me out of my hard earned and their ploy was exactly as above except they lived in North of Scotland.

Colin

The great thing about this thread is that if anyone asks in the future "Do bears shit in the woods ?", I can refer them to Jan as he'll know !:grinning:

Mark Donald and Peter Deere both use the same IP address: 209.85.220.41 . Which means that (not surprisingly) they are one and the same person. This IP address is located in New York, USA.

email (option): wd.register@gmail.com

Thanks Jan...In that case if they ever contact me pretending to be in Europe I'll ask them what the weather's like in NY....Ian:laughing:

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com