Can anyone provide information on the dates of use by BSA of the various types of MT110 tail lamp? This usage by BSA is most likely identical to the manufacture of these at Lucas and therefore the same as by each of the other bike makers.
There are;
The brass ones,
Ones with flats cast on the red lens (it's as if cut like a diamond,)
Types with a rounded smooth surface to the red lens.
Additionally, from reading the existing information from other people on these pages there are subtle differences in the manufacturing of these lamps.
I am most interested to learn about which types were used for the 1937 season which ran from August 1936 until the end of July 1937. For another project I'm interested in the 1930 season which ran from August 1929 until the end of July 1930. And yes these season dates are correct.
Also, can anyone say the best way to successfully convert these tail lamps into a combined stop AND tail lamp? Does anyone do a kit? Of issue here is not to provide the stop lamp function with the ability to increase illumination of the tail lamp too much if possible. In other words I would prefer to install two separate LED's rather than have the one filament having two voltages applied to it, some being lost in a resistor on one lead.
Regards,
Brian.
email (option): bchambersy13@gmail.com
If your going to take this much time and effort to research this subject so exactly then it would seem a shame to spoil all this originality by fitting an LED. I know you need a stoplight by law but this is easily achieved by using a twin filament 6v bulb.
The rivet counters will have a field day. I even got pulled up once for having the incorrect colour coding on a horn wire on a Gold Star. Of course you can always tell them to sod off as I did!
I have found it nigh-on impossible to locate primary sources relating to pre-war Lucas components and their habit of supersession using existing part numbers has meant that the more available post-war lists are next to useless. They seem to have published individual parts books for cars, lorries and even tractors but I have never seen a pre-war version covering any of the motorcycle factories.
I don't know about the early thirties but the most obvious change is between pre-/ early-war lamps and the post-war equivalents which were still stamped as MT110 but had plastic lenses.
I can provide details on late 1939 fitments (the dated Lucas components on my 16H were all dated 11/39)These had a glass lens but it is smooth on the outside (the moulded faceting is on the inner surface). lens bezel seems to be aluminium.
The major advantage to my mind of using a brake light system with a resistor is that it allows the use of the original brass screw connector. A separate brake light element will require a double cable...It may just be possible to feed a double cable through the existing connector but only if it is drilled out which is something that I didn't want to do. If you do go down the resistor route then LEDs are the only way to avoid a constant 21w drain on the dynamo. My LED draws about 0.2w as I recall.
It's not possible to see an LED lamp behind the glass lens so it is invisible to the rivet-counters that some seem to hate so much. I continue to use a 24w tungsten bulb in the headlamp as modern replacements look 'wrong' and out of period behind a 'Difusa' glass.
Rik and Keith,
Thanks very much for your replies.
I have a list titled "Spare parts and Complete Units" and "Motorcycle Equipment 1936" (that is all on the first page of the one list) and also has just below that "M.C.E. 284" January 1937". In this list Lucas say that on the 1936 models they were using part number 526,082 as the MT110 tail lamp for BSA. However one thing I don't know is when their season year ended. Like with BSA it might have ended with the start of the summer holidays or it could even have been as late as December 31? But one can only go by this 1936 list as being what was fitted to 1936 season BSA's unless someone has better information.
Nevertheless, what version of the MT110 was 526,082? One of the politicians once said "Life wasn't meant to be easy" and unfortunately he wasn't far off the mark as it is mighty tough getting things correct.
Regards,
Brian.
email (option): bchambersy13@gmail.com
Brian,
I'm sure I read somewhere the suggestion that good science always gives rise to new questions and I think this is also true of detailed historical reserch. The more that we know, the greater our ability to ask yet further questions.
My impression is that aspects such as lighting equipment were not a great concern to motorcycle manufacturers. From the point of view of marketing, it was useful to have the 'latest' design from a reputable supplier, especially one with a substantial advertising budget such as Lucas as it would reassure customers.
I'd be very surprised if small updates such as an extra rivet or a small material change whether with revised part number or not (and Lucas tended not to if parts were 100% interchangeable) would have been restricted to model years. Certainly with Nortons which I know best, there are frequent suggestions that improvements were included on the last of the previous model year machines as well as next years.
I've checked the military VAOS lists for lighting fitments that I have for Norton WD contracts dated between 1937 and 1940 and they all specify the MT110 with part number 526118 or 526118 SG (this latter simply referred to 'Service Green' which was the current WD vehicle colour.
I have no idea if the difference between 526082 and 526118 was simply the colour. 526118 clearly changed from Bronze Green to Khaki Green with no change of part number during the period that it was specified.
We may just be able to ascertain a little more if the civilian list that you have also includes component part numbers as well as complete assemblies. I'd certainly be interested to see a copy of that document.
Rik.
Rik,
If you give me your email address I will send you a scan of it for your use only. It takes a bit to understand it but when you do it is pretty comprehensive, however it does include an error or two or even three, (it is from Lucas after all!), but these are mainly to do with the writers comprehension of models from firms that he can't have been familiar with. I would think that accuracy of the Lucas part numbers would be virtually impeccable.
Regards,
Brian.
email (option): bchambersy13@gmail.com
I have similar lists for 1934 and 1935. I also have photocopies of earlier lists bus these are not good enough to reproduce.
Regards,
Leon
email (option): leonhop3_at_planet_dot_nl
Would anyone know the earliest know date that BSA used the MT110?
Cheers Darren
Darren,
I saw it recently saying that it was I THINK 1925. But, there are quite a few variations to it going from;
All brass body construction, to a
Steel body with a lens with flats like on a diamond, to a
Steel body with a lens having a rounded shape.
There were different versions of it too with I believe (but aren't certain) glass or plastic lenses.
If you find out which one was in use for both the 1930 and 1937 seasons can you let me know please. For BSA the seasons ran from August 1929 until July 1930 and August 1936 till July 1937.
Regards,
Brian.
email (option): bchambersy13@gmail.com
Hello Brian
I have seen a 1926 Lucas booklet showing the Mt110 and SS47 headlamp MD magdyno.
My 1930 booklet shows a Mt110 and H52 MBD magdyno.
My 1931 Bsa parts catalogue lists either a H52 or MC140 headlamp presuming you bought the optional instrument panel. M40 headlamp was offered for models with Maglita.
MS1 magdyno was offered on all models, but so was KM1 and KSA1 magnetos.
It also lists horn and saddle types.
I am informed that carbide lighting was offered until 37.
My 1951 Lucas booklet has a wiring diagram for Triumph that was issued September 1951, so does the Lucas season start in September? The MT110 is still drawn in this booklet as well as the 480.
Regards Darren
Not a 'spert on this subject, but why would Lucas have "seasons"? They made stuff and the manufacturers used is - or in some cases manufacturers requested specific parts to be made to spec so I understand.
But the motorcycle manufacturers ran to seasons, not Lucas, AMAL, Dunlop etc......