Below is a Dispatch Rider's BSA back on home turf during the war - Sydney (from the AWM photo archives). Looks like the only marking on the home service bike's is the Army registration number on the petrol tank.
I can quote chapter and verse on BEF markings but Australian vehicles outside of the Middle East are pretty much an unknown for me. It does certainly look from the images available on the AWM that there were, in general, neither 'Formation Signs' nor 'Arm of service' markings applied to vehicles in Austraia. However, they are likely to have been applied to the vehicles of units scheduled for departure.
We know from photographs that British units arriving in Singapore had the coloured Arm of service squares already applied but it is unclear if there were also formation signs.
Personally, I think that it would be a wonderful tribute to the men of the 8th Division who suffered so much if you were to apply the emu of 8th Div. It certainly looks as if your bike at some point had something to do with that posting.
I have to say, seeing the decent condition of the lugs, there is no way that it has survived a post-war existence in the make-do-and-mend regions of the pacific prior to repatriation.
The ledgers seem to make it clear that it was taken off strength in Australia so in all probability, it never went overseas or must have returned prior to 1942. Did any Australian units travel to Singapore in 1941 and return with equipment ?
Hi Rik,
"If I could trouble you for one last thing, could you photograph your front fuel tank mount from the rear ? It is as yet unclear when the reinforcing rib was added" - Sorry, haven't figured out how to insert the previous post in the cool inserted box yet.
Here are the photos you requested - is this the right area you were wanting? Hope they answer your question:
email (option): robert.g.elliott@gmail.com
"If I could trouble you for one last thing, could you photograph your front fuel tank mount from the rear ? It is as yet unclear when the reinforcing rib was added" - Sorry, haven't figured out how to insert the previous post in the cool inserted box yet.
Hi Rob,
You have to use the "quote" button in the right hand corner of the original message...
Cheers,
Jan
email (option): wd.register@gmail.com
just saw this on the web: old bike australsia article on your bike:
https://www.shannons.com.au/club/news/old-bike-australasia-norton-16h-war-horse/
Rob, Thanks for the extra photos. You have the early, weaker tank mount (as have I on W4216). The earliest certain date that I have for the reinforced mount is Kostas' W19518 which dates from the latter part of 1940 so we're now a little closer to pinning down when the change actually occured.
The extra research seems to be paying dividends too. It will require further analysis to see how many of the W12000 series were delivered and to where. 'H&M' were certainly listed in the pre-war Norton ledgers but I don't recall them in connection with any military type machines.
The WD contract commencing at W14000 had a price per machine of £52-17-0. These were machines supplied delivered to UK destinations and with a two year (!!) guarantee. It's clear from civilian sales that prior to WW2, the overseas agents purchased ex-works and were responsible for transport and also for all warranties. Presumably they had a claim against the factory but the end-customer does not seem to have had. I think that we can therefore assume that Disney's paid Norton something less than £52, but charged the Australian Government considerably more !
We also don't know if these contracts included an agreed quantity of spares - UK WD contracts often had 10% spare engines and frames and 5% spare gearboxes.
Yours is the only survivor known in the W12000 series according to Rob vd B's lists and we know of no W11000s or W13000s.
Is mine the reinforced type? Frame W20330. Ron
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
Yes Rik. My 16H came to me in civy trim with quite a few early features but fitted with pannier rack and pillion seat etc. So I decided to depict the bike as being brought up to a later war specification. My 1940 M20 is the same! Not so important for me as I have other bikes that I've devoted time and effort to make period factory correct....
And it's so handy having panniers.
I did have a matching pair of pannier toolboxes and kick myself for letting them go, just in case I felt the need to convert it back to original spec
Ron
email (option): ronpier@talk21.com
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did a search and don't think its been posted before :
heres alink to the history of Finaly bros in Melbourne:
http://www.finlaybrothershistory.info/page46.html
has two photos - one of which I have seen on here : WM20's ready for delivery
and a reminisces of some one who worked there :
An employee of Finlay Brothers who began work in the firm's Workshop during the wartime era of 1942 feels that they are probably B.S.A. M20 500cc side valve motorcycles - a model used extensively by the British forces - and recalls that:
"The new bikes arrived in knocked down form and had to be assembled oil added road tested etc."
"The Brownout headlight fitting was standard."
"With the return of the 9th. Divvy from the M.E. [Middle East] early 1943 to fight in N.G. there was a great influx of bikes they bought back with them for repairs to the Finlay's workshop, they had had a tough life in the deserts over there. I worked on later shipments of [B.S.A.'s] and WLA. Harleys with the arrival of the [Americans]."1. Brian Lanyon, personal communication, May 9, 2013.
