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James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

WD James ML owners............thanks to my long-term friend John Tinley I have today examined and measured the marking positions on an original James ML fuel tank............

"The Famous James" logo is applied to the tank-top centrally exactly 1/2" down from the front-edge of the tank bridge cutaway............note that the decal does NOT feature "Model ML" below....this was a post-war thing.......

The lubrication instruction decal fits opposite the filler cap, and the top-left corner is positioned exactly 1/4" below the base of "The Famous James" decal and the corner sitting directly below the centre of the "S" (in the "James")......

The original "C" number that looks to have been originally decals too, rather than painted, comprises letters and numbers 1 & 1/2" tall..........the "C" in the number is positioned, in the case of all ML's, above the centre of the serial rather than before, and is followed by a 1/4" "full-stop/dot" after the "C"..............

The actual serial starts 1/4" from the front edge of the fuel tank and the bottom line of the first number is exactly 7.7cm from the bottom edge of the tank..............halfway along the serial number (the 4th number) the bottom line is down to 6.6cm from the botton edge of the fuel tank.........

As for the "C", the bottom of this is positioned exactly 1/4" above the top-line of the centre digit of the serial number, the "full-stop" sitting over the top-left corner of the next digit in line.............

Hopefully, this will assist in marking-up tanks correctly, and thanks to this tanks owner JT
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email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Well done for compiling those measurements Steve. Mine are not far off from those measurements and I can't remember where I got my measurement info from.

Ron

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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Steve, glad to be of some help. I am having some accurate stencils of the C number made up by Paul Andreson from Noosta Direct. He has put considerable effort in making the letters and numbers correct to my tank as they do not appear to be from a known font. I am sure he would be happy to make a set for you and any other forum members. Cheers John

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Mine is about the same! no C number (yet!)



Cheers,

Lex

email (option): welbike@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Ron, you seem to have the incorrect lubrication decal there compared to Lex's original !!! Classic transfers have the correct one however.....

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Yes, it was made from my pictures, and measurements from this tank.

Cheers,

Lex

email (option): welbike@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Poor Ron, now he's got even more work to do!! had not noticed the difference.

Cheers,

Lex

email (option): welbik@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Well that's not fair! It's the one Bob told me is correct! Have to see if it's possible to remove without damaging my paint work Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Only odd thing is I obtained the correct lubrication decal from Classic Transfers back in the early 1990's when I first restored our James.......so in their catalogue way back then..............in the last few days I've obliterated it prior to the recent re-spray in SCC NO.2 brown....and very nice it looks too.......

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

I might also add that Classic Transfers will do "C" numbers in the correct 1 & 1/2" size complete and ready to apply...........about £5 per side..........contact them, they will make whatever number you want.............

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

I have decided to re-do my tank and get it as close as possible to these originals. I've emailed Bob and Marcia with my order.

Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Bob and Marcia at Classic Transfers are possibly two of the nicest people you could ever deal with.......nothing seems to be too much trouble for them.......I would highly recommend them........

Remember, they can do "C" numbers in the correct size (non "stenciled" type) ready to apply in one.............but I am also certain that they could do the stenciled type if required.....all in the correct 1 & 1/2" size at £5 per side............

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Yes Steve I've had several stencils from them in the past. I've sent them pictures of both JT's and Lex's tank with your dimensions.
I don't know why I had that wrong lube transfer, but I thought Lex had recently given them correct ML information?
Anyway My engine is rebuilt and painted, so I might as well re-paint the tank.

Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

That's good news Ron....but have you sorted-out that gear-change issue ??

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

The gear change stiffness was simply the detent plunger at the back of the gearbox. I thought it might have been the wrong spring so I ordered a new one from Villiers Services, which was exactly the same. It just seems so stiff to me. For the moment I have put a much lighter spring in. The tank gear change mechanism doesn't seem strong enough to overcome the pressure of that spring??

Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

In fairness Ron, the ML's tank change is sloppy and imprecise on the best of days !!! The RE Flea is much better...........

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Steve, that must be the only positive point on the Flea engine!!!

Ron, Only had the transfers made half a year ago??

So you must have done that before that?


Sorry that you have to do it over again,

Lex

email (option): welbik@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Yep. But it's no great problem in the grand scheme of things. However, spinning my rebuilt engine over by the mag wheel, isn't producing a spark I might need a new ignition coil. Ron
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email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Ron, I am not sure about this but it could also be that over the last 70 years the magnetism in the flywheel magneto may have fallen to a level that will not produce a spark. However, I have today spoken to a man in Hammersmith who can re magnetise it for me. I am going to take my flywheel tomhim as soon as I can. He has remagnatised a flywheel for a friend that was from a Bantum to great effect. I can give you his contact details if you would like to make contact. Cheers JT

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Ron, apols, but looks like you have a post-war gearbox end cover too ? WD versions do not seem to feature the "flat" section with numbers applied......

Not sure if there are any actual casting or other differences, but here is a WD original still with traces of olive-drab paint remaining.........I will have a spare for you if needed

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email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Ron, also have a decent selection of Villiers 9D engine ignition flywheel assemblies here, several still fitted with coils that may be good.......the other thing to check/replace on these is the condensor, though get an original Villiers one rather than one of the copies...........I again have several originals that may still be good..........

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Mine was a false alarm John. I simply didn't have the HT lead connected at the mag properly. I have a very healthy spark on my old fashioned 18mm plug now.
The flywheel has a lot of magnetic pull on it when you remove/fit it.
One thing to note. The manual tells you to line up the marks on the flywheel and back plate at TDC. Which will give you the points breaking at 5/16" BTDC. Not so in my case. The marks are about 1/2" apart. Best to time it with the head off and measure the piston in the bore. I had this same issue with my Welbike.

Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Learning all the time. I'd be very grateful for the gearbox end cover Steve.

Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Already put aside for you Ron

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

While talking about Villiers engines, when was this cast iron primary chaincase used:



Must be something late war?? will use it eventually on my James, if I can ever find a suitable Original frame.

Cheers,

Lex

email (option): welbike@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Never seen a wartime ML fitted with that strange screwed-on plate at the front of the casing Lex...........cast-iron does indeed suggest 40s, but not ML in my humble opinion.......and "Iron" and ML ("Military Lightweight") seem at odds here..........

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Yes, the matchless "Lightweight" was not too light anymore and the end of the war!!

The oval plate is cast in aswell, not a loose part, strange stuff!!

Thanks,

Lex

email (option): welbike@wel***.net

Re: James ML Fuel Tank Marking Positions

Gone through a pile of these Villiers primary outers today, mostly ex-WD, some still bearing traces of SCC No.2 brown and a couple late-war (post-April '44) British olive drab..........all are alloy Lex, no sign of steel/iron anywhere...........are we sure this is James or something else fitted with a 9D Villiers engine ? Pre and post-war, the 9D unit was fitted to a number of other bikes by various manufacturers............

email (option): sjmwdbikemad@aol.co.uk

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