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Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

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email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Hi Andrew,

Nice helmet. It's either a para helmet or a dispatch helmet. Look unissued. Legality? Where I live, no.

The markings are all great! BMB was the maker.

Good find!

email (option): britool51@hotmail.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

It's a steel DR helmet. Ask your local police dept as to legality. My guess is they will say no, unless you live here where you dont need to wear a helmet.

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Hi Andrew, this is a MKII Despatch riders steel helmet made from 1943-1954. The para helmet is the same shell but has straps instead of the leather neck and flaps.

They are legal in UK, as laws are not enforced retrospectively. Therefore if it was made as a motorcycle crash helmet and was legal at the time, it still is. You might have to argue the point with your local bobby though

email (option): horror@blueyonder.co.uk

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Well what a spot of luck! My father bought this in the 70s at a show and we always thought it was a para helmet, one of the rather spurious reasons that I marked up the M20 as a Para DR bike was because i thought it would not look too stupid if I was riding it with a Para helmet on. It would certainly have been the subject of much chat, but this is even better if its a genuine DR helmet. It has a sandpaper type paint finish on it which is a strange, not sure why. Now I just need him to find the DR coat he has somewhere too. thanks guys

email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

We have seeked out the legislation on these helmets in UK and it is as Horror says. Confirmed at one time by PC Steve Madden. As long as it's original! A reproduction would not pass muster. I was at the Southsea D Day show years ago. One of the dealers had several big cardboard box's full of these, brand new. 10 to a box and £10 each. You can expect to pay up to £100 for a used one now.
Andrew, don't be too smug about it not being a Para helmet. That would be worth £300-£600! Or even a grand or two if it had leather straps (early pattern) Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Well it looks like I can ride with it, which is good news. Thanks, you know Ron, we may well have bought this at Southsea as well. I am sure my Dad would have picked it up for a tenner. I reckon the last time we were there was about 1989/90 so its possible I have my dates wrong, but we were there earlier years, certainly 1984 as well as i was off to Normandy in my Half Track straight from the show. Those were the days, petrol price at 187p and 5mg seemed extravagant then...wow what would it be now

http://www.theaa.com/public_affairs/reports/Petrol_Prices_1896_todate_gallons.pdf

email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Yes it would have been exactly around that time when I saw them. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

I remember that stall well Ron, Paul (son) and myself got one of each for £18, I still wear the Don R now, (well, when I am on the bike)

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

insuranse companies as to whether they would pay out for injurys when wearing a non certificated helmet

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

the legality question rumbles on...the helmet law is retrospective, and hinges on whether the lid was ever subject to a BS approval...so, if its kite marked, its legal for ever...
if not, it isnt.

however, as a type manufactured for a specific purpose, one could argue it was subject to the relevant BS of its day...

email (option): chris.astinbarker@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

The law seems to have become quite complicated. There was no talk about 'designed to be used as a motorcycle helmet' when compulsory helmets was introduced. All crash helmets had to be approved to at least BS2001.

Anyone wearing a DR helmet in 1972 would have been likely to find themselves sharing a cell with Fred Hill.

However, the single European market meant that they had to allow the wearing of helmets which met the requirements of other European countries. I can imagine that daunted by the prospect of incorporating the standards of however many countries (would it have been 17 at the time ? ), plus all their retrospective aspects and anomalies would have been too much for a single regulation and they copped out by stating 'designed to be used as a motorcycle helmet'.

I very much doubt that this was intended to include manganese steel shrapnel helmets made before any European government thought of helmet safety standards.

From a legal aspect though, what the hell. It's a £50 fine and not endorsable.

The biggest worry is probably the injury compensation aspect. A claim for brain damage (try proving that with a BSA owner ! ) would likely be fought by a third-party insurer and reduced by the civil courts.

The general consensus seems to be that most of us will chance something period for gatherings and runs of WD vehicles but don't wear them to the shops very often.

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

I think that's a fairly accurate assessment of where you stand with the law and may stand with the insurance companies in the event of a head injury. The second also applying to any arguably non compliant helmet that pre dates the laws (and all modern replicas such as Davida 'pudding basins' which definitely don't comply either).
As an M20 owner I am a risk taking adrenalin junkie anyway...so whats changed? ...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Wonder what the cops would say about my first pattern DR helmet made of cork and paper mache. DR's actually hated the switch over to the steel helmet which was heavy and uncomfortable. The first pattern offered no protection against punctures, but they look cool with the goggles, although my wife says I look like a bugg eyed cone head. What does she know!

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Ha Ron, I spoke to Dad and mentioned that the Para helmet would have been worth more. So what did he do? Went off for an hour and called back having found one ! well he tells me its one, but until I can see it I will have to defer judgment. I am discovering that whilst my beloved father didnt buy the Spitfire in crates for £500 in 1947, he did pick up a few things that are now quite sought after. Feeling pretty lucky to be honest! Even in my lifetime, I am 50, things that I used to see at shows for peanuts are now really valuable Thank goodness I had a Magpie for a father! He even has an original unissued Irvin which he bought out of the Exchange and Mart, complete with the power heating plugs!

Here he is, ex RAF, 1924 model , Ground Engineer on Spits, Mosquitos and Thunderbolts to mention a few, My Dad.

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email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

I wish I'd kept a few of the old bikes I ran as a youngster, ah well!

I wonder if the rough paint finish was to stop the Germans from sticking magnetic mines to the helmet

email (option): stinkypete80@hotmail.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

God bless him Andrew. Give him my regards for his efforts.

I'm with Ian and Rik on the helmet issue.
Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

My brother got me one at stafford mechanics show - 1945 dated size 7 but its missing the tie cord at the back & some of the white webbing inside seems to have been cut

Shame it looks to have seen little use, most deterioration down to poor storage

Any into on where i could get a new cord or white webbing from ?

Many thanks

Job

email (option): Jonnyob1@googlemail.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Sam,

What's wrong with looking like a bugg eyed cone head. I don't mind riding along side a bugg eyed cone head if you don't mind riding along side a pudgy little doughboy!!

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

there is a loose single white string, viewable in one of the above photos, Anyone know what its for?

email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

It's there to adjust those other tapes tighter or looser to get the best fit for your head. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

But make sure the knot isn't resting on your head after adjustment...after a few miles riding it feels like someone has knocked a nail through your skull... ...Ian

email (option): ian@wright52.plus.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

perfect thanks Guys. I will have a play around with it to try to get it comfortable. All I need now is the rest of the gear!

email (option): andrew.honychurch@btinternet.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

It's as Ian says. It quite surprising how sore your head can get. I always have a pad of kitchen roll inside my DR helmet. Ron

email (option): ronpier@talk21.com

Re: Whats this helmet and are they legal to ride with?

Well done your Dad, always so nice to make lovely finds like those.
I had a brand new DR lid for a few years, I paid £15 for it in 2003/4 and held on to it promising myself I'd get the M20 to go with it one day, few things happend and thought I'd never own an M20 so sold the lid, then a few more things happened / changed and I now have the M20 and two helmets, one is "brand" new I paid £65, the used one came from one of the forum members here, just prior to the 65th when prices were going nuts, at a very reasonable and sensdible price £50 odd I think. After about 1hr of riding it still aches a bit and its over 60 years old ;-) Hang on to that Irvine its worth a small fortune..

email (option): kit247@hotmail.com

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