In Queensbury, after all only about 10 miles from Keighley, we'd say:
"Chumping" rather than "Progging", which (to my shame?) I encountered for the first time on this thread;
"Blegging"(also "Bleggies" for blackberries themselves);
"(Fish)Cakes" for your "Scones" described by Arthur, although it seems most regions adopt Shaun's definition of that particular "chip 'oyle" delicacy.

"Scrumping" is a term so frequently bandied about these days that I can't honestly remember where I first encountered it!

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Dudley, West Midlands

"Chumping" is interesting. A relative from Wakefield (way back when I was a lad) used the term "jumping" (for progging) which I think was then fairly widely used in Sth Yorks.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Another alternative we used a lot was "plotting", its origin being obvious. The bonfire itself was generally referred to as "our plot" and Nov.5th itself as "plot night".
We had much more fun playing mischief on the evening of Nov.4th in those days of course, but there doesn't seem to have been any such tradition in the West Midlands where I now live. Is it still alive around Keighley, or is it largely replaced by that tedious "trick or treat" of American origin?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Dudley, West Midlands

We used to have a bakery and my grannie made a short pastry filled with currants (a bit like eccles cakes) and sold them as scones, while scones not a bit like my grannie's are now served with jam and cream for a cream tea. She also baked something called a crackney which was sweet mixture that were baked flat.

My mother baked crackneys - I don't think owt much of nutrition went into them in the early '40s - Perhaps we ought to tell the up-and-comings about rationing and it's effect on daily life and health. There were no obese kids then with expensive Apple toys to induce introversion

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Me mam still makes both.
The pastry with just currants is Eccles Cake, but me dad calls it Fly Cake. When shredded mint leaves are added it's Crackney.
By the way, did you hear about the chap that drowned in a bowl of muesli - a strong currant pulled him in!

Ah but not only did Mum/Gran make Crackney, these just had currents, and were hardish in texture, more like a biscuit. Mint and Currant Pasty was two layers of softer pastry with mint and current inside. Delicious !

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-1964

Current location (optional) Wirral

>> these just had currents

high or low voltage?

Strange I thought I had corrected it to currant, but looks like I only did the first one.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-1964

Current location (optional) Wirral

Currant pasty, still a favourite of mine , had a slice last night My wife puts Currants, Butter and Vanilla essence and leaves out the sugar . Delicious!

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 43-46

Current location (optional) Tasmania

John Waddington Feather sent me this. It's worth 5 minutes listening time and a good laugh. John says it's "black Yorkshire humour". Whatever does he mean?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00ld1st

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Sorry, folks.
My mistake and I don't seem to have a solution!

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Hope this works = 'ev tried it sow it shud

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2AcJSkUw6M

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Can you bear a little more on progging? I was fascinated to learn from Brian that “Chumping” was used in Queensbury because a couple of miles northwest in Denholme the word was “Progging”. Other Queensbury friends have confirmed that “Chumping” was used and others Googled have spoken of other boarders between the two usages:
“I always referred to obtaining combustibles for Bonfire Night as chumping - that was Calverley. But a mile down the road in Greengates, foreign territory of Bradford, it was called "progging".”
“.. you can tell that my wife came from the opposite side of Bradford to me because when we
went to collect wood for Guy Fawkes night we went "chumping" and she went
"progging".”

All of Keighley seemed to be “Progging” but what about further north? I would like to plot the area in which this word was used.
So far (from Google and friends) I have the following:
PROGGING(Plotting, Plogging, etc.): Keighley, Denholme, Greengates, Windhill
CHUMPING(Jumping, Chubbing, Chomping, etc): Queensbury, Grange, Huddersfield, Northowram, Wakefield, Calverley, Leeds; Derby!
COB-COALING: Oldham

The experts on childlore (I&P Opie) knew nothing of “Progging” in 1959 and thought the Yorkshire-wide term was “Chumping”. Oddly the OED does not list “Chump” or “Chumping” but does have “Prog” – “to gather up fuel for a bonfire on Nov. 5th.”, though only via the English Dialect Dictionary.

If any of you can confirm, contradict or add anything to these findings could you email me being as specific as possible as to date and place of use. (garethwhittaker99@hotmail.com)
Thanks

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1954-59

Current location (optional) Denholme

Masterly, Gareth.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

We allus went proggin' in Haworth. It wasn't restricted to tree branches either, frequestly you would see furniture on the bonfire. I often wonder how many valuable antiques were lost in this way.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-1961

Snowing nicely now but this morning there was a brief flurry which barely whitened the ground. Reminded me of what my father would have said - Well that wa'n't worth waitin' up fo'. This was used for anything that was more disappointing than something that was "summat or nowt".

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

I remember my dad saying "it woh neether nowt nor summat". Same thing,Shaun?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Much enjoyed reading through this section but can't add much. Has anyone mentioned "think on" meaning "take note" as a general admonition. Or "Nah then" as a greeting.With regard to Scandinavian origins of dialect words I remember my mam who was born in Earby telling me about an old farmer who when asked directions to somewhere said "Gang up 'ither till tha sees a white yat and a track as folks have made" The "gang" and "yat" are obviously the operative words cf, German gehen,gang,gegangen etc and "yat" which I think is Swedish for gate.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1940-48

Current location (optional) Epsom

Just re-reading this thread and came across a query about 'raffle-coppin'. It is a Craven District dialect word, so from somewhere over Skipton way. To 'raffle' is to spend one's life in idle pursuits; to lead a loose disorderley life and is probably related to ravel, meaning to tangle in a disorderly manner. A raffle-coppin is a disorderly blade, a wild fellow close to ragamuffin. It is easily 'Googled' and one finds other interesting words on the site.

Nice one, Tom. I remember my mother in hysterics when my dad told her of a chance meeting with a colleague.

"I met him down *#*#*# street .

He said 'Nah then!'

I said ' Nah then, then!'

Can't imagine how you reply to that.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Suited (as in " 'e were reight suited when 'is Grandad giv 'im two bob")
= pleased.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

Yon woman 'as a gob like a torn clog (ie talks too much)

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 58-64

Current location (optional) Wirral

Sweets were sometime called 'spice'. As in 'Has ta getten any spice?'

After KGBS I went to agricultural college, and worked on farms around Silsden in the holidays. One instruction before some tractor-driving task was 'Na think on, tha mun nobbut gan reight pratla'. Which being translated, means 'Remember, proceed cautiously and circumspectly'. Or something like that.

Another piece of agricultural economic wisdom was 'Osses are cheap when they're working, and expensive when they're laiking, and tractors is t'other road abaht'.

Someone who was experiencing some of life's vicissitudes was said to be 'Noan in a reight good seam' - this last word being pronounced with two syllables, naturally. My mother and dad hailed from Wakefield and Burnley respectively (what in Silsden were referred to derisively as 'off-cummed 'uns), so this may reflect the local mining industries.

Someone trying to keep the peace amongst warring family members was 'Keeping t'cart ont wheels' or 'keeping t'band int nick'.

And someone thought to be not entirely sane or rational was often described as 'a shakken devil'. We had quite a few of those in Silsden!

Referring to Brian's previous posting, one of the local 'torn clog' women was memorably referred to as 'Joyce the voice'.

Many years ago there was transport cafe alongside the main road in Steeton. (this was told by my dad, so it must be true). A new driver on heating oil deliveries parked up, and was wondering around trying to find the oil tank. He was spotted by the proprietor.
'What's tha after, lad?'
''eating oil'.
'Ower this way'
.. and he took the driver into the cafe (the eating hoil).

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1957 - 62

Current location (optional) Rochdlae

That lass 'as two backs ! (ie she is flat chested)

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 58-64

Current location (optional) Wirral

I still occasionally use "keep band int nick expression" Andrew. My NZ wife does not have a clue what I am on about. I do it on purpose of course, if I am in the mood, just for a bit of fun and she might respond with, "don't you start speaking Yorkshire here, you are in New Zealand now!" Cheers.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1947-51

Current location (optional) Auckland New Zealand

Never come across the term "Shakken Devil" before. I was more used to hearing such unfortunates referred to as being "a bit short" (such as "elevenpence ha'penny to t'bob") or, in more extreme cases, "three sheets to t'wind" (presumably of nautical origin).

I assume "keepin' t'band i't'nick" to have originated in factories (most likely textile), where, when things went amiss, the belt had a tendency to come off its respective pulley on the overhead drive shaft. Someone out there may have a more confirmed explanation, however.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Dudley, West Midlands

When anyone seemed to be particularly incompetent my dad's favourite expression was "Nay, 'e's like a man med o' band."

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

I well remember being the subject of that particular description, Shaun!
Another one was, "Tha'rt up an' dahn like a big silly lass".

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Dudley, West Midlands

I too remember being upbraided, when not jumping immediately to some task, with "Frame thissen - tha's like a man med o' band"

I need to put more thought into my definition of "shakken". This was not aimed at those of reduced mental capacity, but rather people (usually young males) showing wild, irresponsible, and antisocial tendencies, with a predilection for unjustified risk-taking. Speeding motorists and bikers were a frequent target, also those (in those pre-H&S days) adopting dangerous, short-cut working practices. If you've ever seen the 50's film "Hell Drivers" (showing nightly at the Silsden Picture House), you'll know exactly the sort of character I mean.

Their views were frequently dismissed with "Oh 'im? 'E's bloody shakken!"

I've never seen the word in print, although it was in common use at the time. The spelling might well be "shacken". It might be a derivation of "shaken"?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1957 - 62

Current location (optional) Rochdlae

I guess that band was string, or am I off track?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

Hi Shaun, a furtherance of the man made o' band was the addition "tied up wi string."
I well recall the use of the term "shook" to describe a person of questionable sanity or normality.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Band was definitely string, my mother worked at t'Band Mill in Haworth, Cotton Cords on Sun Street.

My mother- in- law, born and raised in the Worth Valley, was heard to say, on more than one occasion, "I'll be bonny and mad if......." .

The meaning is clear - but what is the origin of the imagery?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Presumably, at the time, your mother-in-law considered herself neither bonny nor mad, despite your possible misgivings concerning the latter, Terry!

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958 - 65

Current location (optional) Dudley, West Midlands

Returning to Bernard's post on Jul 28, 2007 - my sense of the word "nark" was of someone who was a persistent irritant (the manager who was never satisfied with the job etc.) rather than simply someone who bemoaned his own lot. Was this how others viewed the term or did they apply it to any moaner?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

Not sure about "bemoaned his own lot". Rather just moaned a lot.

Reminds me of a word I've been meaning to ask about: did anyone use the term "nerks" (? "nurks") to mean chips? I've never heard it used anywhere but my own village and even there not for about 50 years.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 54-59

Current location (optional) United Kingdom

Finurks=Fish and chips

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1959-66

Current location (optional) Haworth

Was surprised a few years ago to be behind an old fella in Greggs, Headingley. He finishes his request with '.....and gie us a couple o' growlers as well' She certainly knew what he meant. Do you ? In fact it prompted me to have one too. Theres nowt like a decent growler.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 58-64

Current location (optional) Wirral

Growlers? Pork pies of course!'ad tha' nivver 'eard on 'em afore?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958 -65

Current location (optional) Embsay Nr. Skipton

Nivver 'ad in mi Keighley days Brian. Jack Hird used to deliver us meat, including them, but ah nivver knew 'em as growlers.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 58-64

Current location (optional) Wirral

Could it be because they caused an intestinal rumble?

There wer some grand growler (pieces of growler) available in the buffet at the recent (yesterday) kbgs reunion - another success down to Doug Thompson.

Get thissens theer next year - numbers are falling due to Annie Domini and it would be a shame that fewer Keighlians than hitherto fore enjoy the fleshpots so tastefully served up at this annual event.

Get thissens theer!

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

There wer some grand growler (pieces of growler) available in the buffet at the recent (yesterday) kbgs reunion - another success down to Doug Thompson.


I wouldn't be brave enough to tell you what a growler is down this part of the world! Pleased to hear that the re-union went off well and look forward to seeing a few pics soon. Cheers.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1947-51

Current location (optional) Auckland, New Zealand

As far as I'm aware there has only ever been one mention on this site (by Dave Baldwin) of the scrattin' shed at KRLFC. When I was a child it just seemed part of our language. I assumed scrattin' sheds were everywhere (whatever they were).
My father said it was Keighley for "scratching shed". But what did that mean?
Can anyone enlighten me as to the origin of the term, and why it should be used at a RL ground?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Leeds

There's a scratting shed at Wharfedale RUFC - is this a common name for the basic weather shelter provided for loyal supporters who prefer to provide an afternoon of shrewd advice to the ref in contrast to the more refined comments from the 'stand'?

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1958-65

Current location (optional) Embsay Nr Skipton

I don't know the answer to Shaun's question but I suspect it could be a transfer of usage from agricultural to sporting events - although there was a theatre (flicks) in Batley with a scratting shed.

A cry that came out from Lawkholme's scratting shed was - "come on the steam pigs" - ie a hot scrum on a frosty day

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 1952-60

Current location (optional) Nirvana

Others have scratched their heads over your question Shaun:

http://i.rlfans.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=564118

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 54-59

As a lifelong poultry farmer, a "Scrattin" shed would be just that ,a covered ,dry , shed, for the old hens to "Scrat" about in .No doubt Agricultural origin.

Years at KBGS e.g. 1958-1964 (optional) 43-46

Current location (optional) Tasmania