Try to catch the Praise the Lord program on TBN for Monday 12/12/2011 - "Prophecy Night" with Perry Stone, Irvin Baxter - Debate about the Rapture tbn.org

I am watching now on cable...

Here's the link to TBN

LINK

Tomorrow it should be archived under today's date.

Thanks for the link Jim; however, after the way TBN treated Jack Van Impe I won't watch anything on that network now. I also cannot listen to Irvin Baxter. He is adamant that the church will go through the whole tribulation. I have listened to him on radio and he has his scriptures on prophecy so mixed up that he must have thrown them in the kitchen blender. If a person doesn't know the Bible and have a strong grip on prophetic truth, he can really cause confusion.

Perry Stone believes in a partial rapture, I found out much to my dismay. I ordered his set of tapes on the rapture and he spends one whole session on how you must be 'worthy' and the rapture is a 'reward' for good behavior. Almost fell off my chair at that point because I had always enjoyed hearing him teach before. The rapture is the FULLNESS of redemption promised by being sealed with the Holy Spirit at the moment of being born again. It is God's mark on us that we have been "set aside", which is the true definition of holy, for the complete redemption of our body(rapture transformation into incorruptibleness), soul (mind, will and emotions), and spirit (new creature, old things have passed away and all things have become new). This is so basic that it takes effort to twist it into something else.

Anyway, just my 2 cents for whatever it's worth. If anyone would like the set of rapture tapes, let me know and I will send them to you. I am being very careful to only listen to teachers these days that have things straight. My favorite is Gary Stearman on Prophecy In The News.

Sue,
That's quite disturbing that Perry Stone believes in a partial rapture. I've always looked up to him as one of the most knowledgable prophecy teachers, but I didn't know that he believed in a partial rapture. Thanks for letting us know.

Kevin

Yeah, really. Guess I won't be listening to him either, then, for that reason. Thanks for the warning, Texas Sue!

And neither will I, T/Sue, watch Perry Stone anymore either. Thanks for the heads-up about his partial Rapture stance.

I'll only watch Hal Lindsey & Grant Jeffery, and then from there...I'll switch channels to TCM for our classic movies.

Maranatha!
Tammy

I was so disappointed when I heard that dvd where Perry Stone said the rapture was a REWARD for good behavior. I thought he knew the scriptures better than that. He then began to go into great detail about how to measure 'good enough'. All I could think of was the brother of the prodigal son who resented his brother being given a party for coming home. He told his father, 'haven't I been here all along doing everything you want?' In other words, I am the 'good' son. Whiny!

Goes to show you that even the most knowledgable among us can be have their understanding tainted by personal bias. That is why only the Word of God - the Bible - is the only trustworhty words and Jesus is the only one who is truly GOOD. His goodness extended to me is the only way I will get home.

In Isaiah it says that all of our righteousness (the best that we can be in the flesh) is as FILTHY RAGS. Doesn't sound like filthy rags will be enough to get us saved or raptured. So thankful that Jesus has me covered and will come for me soon based on HIS righteousness.

Me, too, Texas Sue! The Lord Himself knows that I can never be good enough to deserve Heaven, no matter how hard I try or how many things I try to do right. It's the blood of Jesus alone that will get me into Heaven, not my works.

I'm just throwing this out there. Hypothetical time: Let's say someone gets saved at 17, is a new creation in Christ, repents of their sins and gets washed in the blood, baptized in the Holy Spirit, the whole she-bang. He attends Church and stays in the Word, his walk with Jesus has been steadily become more intimate year after year.

Now he is 29, and it is the season of the Rapture, he isn't paying attention to the signs, has no idea where Israel even is, and is under-a-rock in regard to how destructive this year's natural disasters have been. He is not well-versed in prophecy, and doesn't see how the Arab Spring is directly related to Isaiah 19, Jeremiah 49, Psalm 83, etc...

He has been backsliding big time, fallen back into going out with his Wall Street buddies, doing coke in bathrooms and taking home girls every other night.

Let's say the actual night of the Rapture this man (let's call him Biff), Biff, is in the process of fornicating with a random girl and is blacked out from alcohol and cocaine abuse. He has no recollection of what he is doing in the moment...does Biff hear the shofar? Does Biff get transformed in an instant? Or does Biff land in the category of "...those whom I love I discipline" (Rev.3:19) Does Biff get "vomited out of Jesus' mouth"? (Rev.3:16)

I am not sure where I stand on the Partial Rapture thing, yes of course Biff is saved by Grace. His eternal soul is secure by the sacrifice of Christ on the cross. But does he have to be a part of "the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God," (Rev.20:4)?

There ARE going to be born-again Christians not paying attention to the signs when it happens, and there will be some Christians partying their heads off on the day/night of the Rapture. Some Believers will be non-coherent when it happens. Some will be caught-in-the-act of fornication/sodomizing which is a grievous sin against the Temple of God, our bodies. Does that body that is unrepentantly sinning in the moment of the catching away get "changed in an instant"? That is a hard question to answer, and one that I don't think any human has the ability to with 100% confidence. That is why I personally think Jesus told us to WATCH so many times, so that we would know He was near, and refrain from having spots or blemishes on our Wedding Garments (unrepentant sins).

What do you think? I think this is a very heavy issue indeed.

-Clay

Regarding Biff, he has quenched the Holy Spirit and abused the Grace of the Lord. He will not be saved.

1 Thess. 5:19
Quench not the Spirit.

Matthew 12:31
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.

John tells us that there is a sin that does not result in death and that there is a sin that does result in death. The sin unto death is grieving the Holy Spirit.
1 John 5:16-17

Hebrews 6:4-6
4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

You can't be born again AGAIN. It's a one time deal. You are born again and walk in the newness of life. You are a New Creature in Christ, to quote Paul.

Hebrews 10:26-27
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Having said all that you will go in the Rapture if you are a BORN AGAIN, SPIRIT FILLED follower of Christ. You have the oil of the Holy Spirit in your Lamp and it's burning a bright, clean flame.

Grace and Peace be with you all!

If you know a Biff, I'd be advising him to repent.
It cannot be good to continue this path.
This story example begs the question though about Christians who sin which leads to divorce or following divorce or trouble with the law or whatever sin you can think of. Always, I'd advise someone to stop and return to submission to the Lord.
Accept the Lordship of Christ today
The osas argument goes back and forth. There is plenty of invisible sin around such as pride and idolatry. We need to be careful about prejudging.

What was proposed in this theoretical story of Biff can only be characterized as unrepentant, willing sin with no regard for the Holy Spirit that dwells within.

This is making a mockery of our Lord and the Grace he bestowed when he took upon him the sin and shame of the entire world of all the ages.

The story illustrates blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. You will know them by their fruits....can a good tree produce bad fruit? or a bad tree produce good fruit?

Shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? GOD forbid!

There is a sin that doesn't lead to death and there is a sin that leads to death. This was an example of the latter.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is the only unforgivable sin. Blasphemy is the rejection of the Holy Spirit; nothing more nothing less. That's why the Bible says that blasphemy against the Son will be forgiven but not against The Holy Spirit. It is the total rejection of the Holy Spirit that condems them.

That is wrong K.

The reason it's the unforgivable sin is explained in detail in Hebrews 6:4-6.

If after a person has felt the POWER of the Holy Spirit and partaken of the promise of power from on high but has gone on to quench the fire of the Lord they have cast off the down payment for their inheritance. Much like Esau, whom the Lord hated.

And that is TOTAL rejection of the Holy Spirit after having known the promise of the Kingdom of Heaven to cast it away.

Please read carefully the scriptures posted above.

Also in the proposed story one must question, was he REALLY born again to begin with?

Grace and Peace.

Philip, you gave an excellent answer to my hypothetical, and Regina, it was just an hypothetical (praise God).
I don't know anyone in particular that is in this sad state.

You are spot on my brother.

Ok Jesus, your Bride is ready. Use us in a mighty way in this late hour for your Glory, then please bring us home. Again Lord, we are ready.