I know that no one can really answer this one way or another...but here goes...
I saw a few videos of some peple who have ither had visions or nde's of hell. To make it short and to the point, they said that therewere Christians in hell for not tithing or no tithing consistently.

I believe in tithing. I heard that we bring a curse on ourselves when w don't tihe. But honestly, we have struggled so badly this past year, I have barely tithed. Which is probablythe curse from not tthing. Now that I watched the videos, I am afraid that we might miss the rapture...or worsel end up in hell because we were not consistent tithers.

No one is Father, so I don't expect anyone to know, however I would like some light shed on the subject. Please and thank you.

All so-called visions have to align with God's Word; if they don't, then they're not from God. And these visions are not. The only thing that will send any person to Hell is his refusal to accept Jesus' free gift of salvation. It's not our works that get us saved, and it's not our works that keep us saved, either.

Thank you Kathy. I agree with what you are saying. These testamonies seem to line up with the word of God. They're saying that listening to secular music, gossiping about others in the church, and tithing. (Which e all agree is wrong) One person is a pastor from Asia. This just confuses and worris me.

Actually, they don't line up with the Word of God. (That's what you meant to say, right?) And regarding secular music, well, I beg to differ with them. All secular music is not sinful. It depends on the secular music--some is, and some isn't.

Hi, I found this link, and it seems spot on, and informative. Please read:

http://www.truthguard.com/Articles/is-tithing-biblical-a22.html

Of course an unwillingness to obey Jesus will not lead us into His heaven, but we also want to make sure we aren't being legalistic as to not cheapen His work on the cross. Above all else, seek His leading and conviction on the matter, like I am doing (i dont even attend a formal church for many of the same reasons other Spirit-filled believers don't). I would venture to say that some of the most Christ centered individuals I know don't tithe,,, so read that article to see why. Again, it may be a case by case thing, so dont do anything based off what I say. Lord bless!

K.,

There is a good free book on the internet in regards to tithing. I'm going to list a snippet of it here, and you can downland and read the rest if you want.

I think you'll be surprised, as to who should tite and it had nothing to do with money. Also the poor, widows, etc. are suppose to benefit from the tithe, not just the church alone. It's biblical, and perhaps your church should be helping you, because you are in dire straits.

Don't believe everything you hear.

Read and be blessed and put your mind to rest.

God knows you situation, don't worry!

Blessings!

Valerie

"Fair Use for Information & Discussion Purposes"

http://www.tithing-russkelly.com/id11.html

Should the Church Teach Tithing?
A Theologian's Conclusions about a Taboo Doctrine
Russell Earl Kelly, PHD
www.tithing-russkelly.com
www.shouldthechurchteachtiting.us
russell-kelly@att.net


TO DOWNLOAD THIS BOOK FREE
TO BUY THIS BOOK
Video version of essay point 2; always only food
Video version of essay point 3; not money
Video version of essay point 5; no minimum
Video version of essay point 8: firstfruits
Please email me at russell-kelly@att.net


Revised February 2007



What is a biblical tithe? The word is so common among conservative Christians that everybody thinks that he or she knows exactly what it means. However, a serious problem with understanding tithing appears at the very beginning of this book because of the serious disagreement about the definition of “tithe.” The Hebrew and Greek words for “tithe” both simply mean “a tenth.” However, beyond this simple definition, much ­ difficulty exists in defining the contents of the tithe. If a legal court case were being held, a working definition would have to be agreed upon by all involved parties before the presentation of a case could ­ proceed. However, since this is not possible, four definitions of “tithe” will be ­ presented. Although many contend for the third definition, this book will use the fourth, Mosaic Law definition. Even this choice of a working definition will be of great concern to many because of long-standing traditional ideas of the content of the tithe.

The Pagan and General Definition

The first definition of “tithe” is a general all-inclusive definition which is not used in the main portion of this book. The Encyclopedia Americana defines the general tithe as “the tenth part of produce or other income, paid voluntarily or under the compulsion of law for the benefit of religious institutions, the support of priests and pastors, and the relief of those in need.” This definition does not distinguish between ecclesiastical tithes from church laws, personal tithes from trade and agricultural tithes.



Encyclopedia of Religion, “In the ancient Near East lie the origins of a sacred offering or payment of a tenth part of stated goods or property to the deity. Often given to the king or to the royal temple, the ‘tenth’ was usually approximate, not exact. The practice is known from Mesopotamia, Syria-Palestine, Greece and as far to the west as the Phoenician city of Carthage.”



Westminster Dictionary of the Bible, “A 10th part of one’s income consecrated to God. The separation of a certain proportion of the products of one’s industry or of the spoils of war as tribute to their gods was practiced by various nations of antiquity. The Lydians offered a tithe of their booty (Herod. I, 89). The Phoenicians and Carthaginians sent a tithe annually to the Tyrian Hercules. These tithes might be regular or occasional, voluntary or prescribed by law.”



This general tithe is of pagan origin and precedes the Mosaic Law’s tithe by many centuries. In Genesis 41:34 Joseph encouraged the Egyptians to double their tithe in order to cover the lean years. In Genesis 14 Abraham was obligated to pay a tithe from the spoils of war in obedience to the Arab war custom. In New Testament times the Roman Empire received the first tithe of ten percent of grains and twenty percent of fruit trees from its conquered subjects, including Judah.



Although an additional full ten percent “spoils of war” tithe was not incorporated into the Mosaic Law, an additional one percent is mentioned in Numbers 31:25-47. Almost every theological commentator discusses this ancient custom in Genesis 14:21, which links it to the tithe in verse 20.

The Tithe as a General Offering

A second definition of “tithe” is most common among moderate and ­ liberal churches which equate tithes with free-will offerings. Members are urged to begin with a small percentage of giving and gradually increase the percentage according to their ability. Among these churches there is little or no reference to an exact compulsory giving of ten percent from gross income as a legal requirement. Since many of the liberal churches assign Adam through Moses to mythology and believe the Pentateuch was written after the exile, they usually base their approach to giving on general principles rather than specific texts.



Also, many who hold this position prefer to use “tithe” to refer to “net” income with certain limitations. They are more likely to say that the poor are not required to give tithes and that tithes are only required from those who make a profit from their labor. They also are more likely to say that church support is not required from those on bare government pension or welfare. The parents’ first duty is to provide essentials of food, clothing, and housing for their family.

The Tithe as Ten Percent of Gross Income

A third definition of “tithe” is taught among many more conservative and fundamental churches. For these churches “tithe” refers to ten percent of “gross” income and is an expectation from all economic classes, both rich and poor alike. In addition to paying salaries of gospel workers and ­ providing social programs, some smaller churches also use the tithe for building funds and payment of all church debts. Their position insists that the tithe is an unchanging biblical standard, or eternal moral principle, which reflects the character of God, preceded the Mosaic Law and was, therefore, not abolished by the Mosaic Law. Exact tithing of ten percent of one’s gross income should be observed by all Christians, and free-will offerings are to be given in addition to the mandatory tithe. Without exception, the tithe must be returned to God first, while other necessities such as shelter, child care, medicine, food, heat, and clothing must be given less priority. The church is obligated to teach tithing because it is a biblical command.



This common conservative definition is rejected and refuted in this book because it fails to consider the correct definition, the purpose, and limitations of the biblical tithe. As mentioned in the introduction, this book deliberately uses many conservative evangelical sources in an attempt to demonstrate that this definition is both legalistic and harmful to the church which should be using much better New Covenant principles.

The Tithe as an Old Covenant Ordinance for Israel

The fourth definition of “tithe” is the precise and narrow Scriptural definition as given in the Mosaic Law in the Old Covenant. The biblical tithe was an ordinance of the Mosaic Law for the use and benefit of national Israel under the Old Covenant. The full tithe was given to the tribe of Levi, first, in exchange for his loss of land inheritance in Israel and, second, because of his servant service to his brothers in the Levitical house of Aaron who alone served as priests. A tenth of the first tithe was, in turn, given by the Levites to the priests who ministered at the altar.



The basic tithe was not to be used for building houses of worship. Since pagan dust defiled, the original tithe consisted solely of the increase of land produce from God’s sanctified land of Israel and from the increase of animals herded on the land of Israel. Although the tithe could be exchanged for its monetary value, the tithe itself never consisted of money! A second (and third) tithe was also given to provide food for festival occasions, and to provide welfare food for widows, fatherless, orphans and needy strangers in Israel.

The Contents of the Tithe
A surprising biblical fact is that the poor did not pay tithes, but, instead, received from the tithe. A separate chapter on the poor discusses this truth. This fact is made especially clear in the gleaning laws and in the purpose of the tithe. Jesus did not tithe, nor did he sin by failing to tithe because he was poor and did not own land or herd animals for his sustenance. The poor were only expected to give free-will offerings to the best of their ability.




From the list in this chapter it is easy to demonstrate that the contents of every recorded tithe found in the Mosaic Law is only from landowners and herdsmen of the land of Israel. This was a totally unexpected, yet very clear, truth about tithing that Bible study with an exhaustive concordance revealed. Also, strange as it may seem, Scriptural tithing was only intended for a society sustained almost wholly by agricultural crops and animal herds.



Biblical society included the following occupations: bakers, candle makers, carpenters, clothing makers, hired farm workers, hired herdsmen, hired household servants, jewelry craftsmen, masons, metal craftsmen, musicians, painters, perfume makers, physicians, sculptors, soldiers, tanners, teachers and tent makers. Yet NONE of these professions or products from these professions are included in any list of tithes or tithing! Why not? These sources provided much of the money for head taxes, temple taxes, tribute to foreign conquerors and, of course, free-will offerings. It is inconceivable to think that God simply forgot to include them in the many lists of items to be tithed.




We must also remember that the Mosaic Law of the ‘firstborn’ would drive all except the firstborn in a family with four sons off the land within 2-3 generations because the firstborn was to get a double portion of the land inheritance (Deut. 21:17). Those with plots of land too small to ­ sustain a family had to sell their portion to their relative with the larger inheritance. Next, they would work as hired hands on their relatives’ land or move to town and take up a trade. For example, a 1000 acre plot would be divided by four sons into plots of 400; 200; 200; and 200 in the first generation; 160; 80; 80; and 80 after two generations; 32; 16; 16; and 16 after three generations. Thus, continually sub-dividing the land would keep the land-tithe the same, but would seriously reduce the amount of persons paying land-tithes.

Tithe Texts Which Reveal Its Limited Contents

Lev. 27:30, 32 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD’s. It is holy to the LORD…. And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passes under the rod, the tenth shall be holy to the LORD.

Num. 18:27 And this your heave offering shall be reckoned to you, as though it were the grain of the threshing-floor, and as the fullness of the wine-press.

Num. 18:28 Thus you also shall offer a heave offering to the LORD of all your tithes, which you receive of the children of Israel; and you shall give thereof the LORD’s heave offering to Aaron the priest.

Deut 12:17 You may not eat within your gates the tithe of your grain, or of your wine, or of your oil

Deut. 14:22 You shall truly tithe all the increase of your seed, that the field brings forth year by year.

Deut. 14:23 And you shall eat before the LORD your God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name, the tithe of your grain, of your wine, and of your oil, and the first offspring of your herds and of your flocks, that you may learn to fear the LORD your God always.

Deut. 26:12 When you have made an end of tithing all the tithes of your increase [produce: NIV, RSV] the third year, which is the year of tithing, and have given it to the Levite, the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within your gates, and be filled.

2 Chron. 31:5 And as soon as the commandment was circulated, the children of Israel brought in abundance the firstfruits of grain, wine, and oil, and honey, and of all the increase of the fields; and the tithe of all things they brought in abundantly.

2 Chron. 31:6 And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that lived in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated to the LORD their God, and laid them by heaps.

Neh. 10:37 And that we should bring the firstfruits of our dough, and our offerings, and the fruit of all manner of trees, of wine and of oil, to the priests, to the chambers of the house of our God, and the tithes of our ground to the Levites, that the same Levites might have the tithes in all the cities of our tillage.

Neh. 13:5 And he had prepared for him a great chamber, where previously they laid the grain offerings, the frankincense, and the vessels, and the tithes of the grain, the new wine, and the oil, which was commanded to be given to the Levites, and the singers, and the porters, and the ­ offerings of the priests.

Mal. 3:10 Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat [food] in my house.

Matt. 23:23 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cumin….



Tithing Was Not an Eternal Moral Principle

A tradition is not automatically an eternal moral principle merely because is it very old, very common and very widespread. The fact that tithing was common in much pagan worship before the Bible was written does not make it a moral principle. Idolatry, worship of astrological bodies, child sacrifice, temple prostitution, witchcraft and necromancy are equally very old, very common and very widespread in pagan cultures. The practice of giving is found in natural law, but an exact percentage is not.

Tithing Was Not a Minimum Required from All Old Covenant Israelites

Only those Israelites who earned a livelihood from farming and herding inside Israel were required to tithe under the Mosaic Law. Their increase came from God’s hand. Those whose increase came from their own crafts and skills were not required to tithe products and money. The poor and needy who did not tithe and received from the tithe gave freewill offerings.



Tithes Were Not the Same as First-fruits



The first-fruit was a very small amount of the first crop harvest and the first-born was the first offspring of animals. The first-fruit was small enough to fit into a hand-held basket (Deut. 26:1-4, 10; Lev. 23:17; Num. 18:13-17; 2 Chron 31:5a). First-fruit and first-born offerings went directly to the Temple and were required to be totally consumed by ministering priests only inside the Temple (Neh. 10:35-37a; Ex. 23:19; 34:26; Deut. 18:4).



Tithes Were Not from Money



One argument to support non-food tithing is that money was not universally available and barter from food must have been used for most transactions. This argument is not biblical. Genesis alone contains “money” in 32 texts and the word occurs 44 times before the tithe is first mentioned in Leviticus 27. The word shekel also appears often from Genesis to Deuteronomy.



In fact many centuries before Israel entered Canaan and began tithing food from God’s Holy Land money was an essential everyday item. For example money in the form of silver shekels paid for slaves (Gen 17:12+); land (Gen 23:9+); freedom (Ex 23:11); court fines (Ex 21 all; 22 all); sanctuary dues (Ex 30:12+); vows (Lev 27:3-7); poll taxes (Num 3:47+), alcoholic drinks (Deu 14:26) and marriage dowries (Deu 22:29).



According to Genesis 47:15-17 food was only used for barter after money had been spent. Banking and usury laws exist in God’s Word in Leviticus even before tithing. Therefore the argument that money was not prevalent enough for everyday use is false. Yet the tithe contents never include money from non-food products and trades.

Examples of Many Authorities Who Agree on This Definition of Tithe

Anchor Bible Dictionary, ‘tithe,’ C. Early Judaism and Christianity, says, “Whereas in the OT tithes apply to specific agricultural products, rabbinic and patristic exegesis tends to include all agricultural products, and eventually [much later] all forms of income as subject to the tithe.”



Alfred Edersheim: “And it is remarkable, that the Law seems to regard Israel as intended to be only an agricultural people—no contribution being provided for from trade or merchandise.”



Fausset’s Bible Dictionary: “The tithe of all produce as also of flocks and cattle belonged to Jehovah.”



Nelson’s Illustrated Bible Dictionary: “The law of Moses prescribed tithing in some detail. Leviticus 27:30-32 stated that the tithe of the land would include the seed of the land and the fruit of the tree. In addition the Hebrew people were required to set apart every tenth animal of their herds and flocks to the Lord…. Nowhere does the New Covenant expressly command Christians to tithe…”



The New Catholic Encyclopedia: “In the Deuteronomic Code the tithe is limited to grain, wine, and oil (Deut. 12:6, 11, 17; 14:22). These texts more or less equate the tithe with other ritual offerings and sacrifices.”



The New Unger’s Bible Dictionary: “The tenth of all produce, flocks, and cattle was declared to be sacred to Jehovah by way, so to speak, of rent to Him who was, strictly speaking, the Owner of the land, and in return for the produce of the ground…. Although the law did not specify the various fruits of the field and of the trees that were to be tithed, the Mishnah (Maaseroth 1.1) includes ‘everything eatable, everything that was stored up or that grew out of the earth….’”



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Encyclopedia Americana, 1996 ed., s.v. "tithe.”

From Encyclopedia of Religion, Mircea Eliad, editor, 1987, s.v. “tithe.” Reprinted by permission of the Gale Group.

John D. Davis, ed., Westminster Dictionary of the Bible (Philadelphia: Westminster Press, 1964), s.v. “tithe.”

Taken from Wycliffe Bible Commentary, Charles F. Pfeiffer and Everett F. Harrison, editors, Moody Press, 1972. Used by permission. Concerning “2 Chron. 31:6,” “The tithe of holy things may be a general term for the token percentages of certain offerings that became the property of the priests (Num. 18:6; cf. Lev. 6:16-7:36).” While several commentaries call this a scribe’s insertion, the RSV omits the second word, tithe, in the text altogether.

Alfred Edersheim, The Temple, Its Ministry and Services, Wm. B. Eerdmann’s, Grand Rapids, chap. 19, p. 379.

Andrew Robert Fausset, Fausset’s Bible Dictionary, CD-ROM (Seattle: Biblesoft, 1999), s.v. “tithe.”

Roland F. Youngblood, ed., Nelson’s Illustrated Bible Dictionary, (Copyright: 1986) CD-ROM (Seattle: Biblesoft, 1999), s.v. “tithe.”

David I. Eggenberger, ed., New Catholic Encyclopedia (New York: McGraw-Hill, 1967), s.v. “tithe.”

Taken from New Unger’s Bible Dictionary, Merrill Unger, Moody Press, 1986, s.v. “tithe.” Used by permission.

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Thank you Valerie. Your answer is great.

Wow! I read the article you posted above. Thank you. We've been in church for many years, and that's the one thing that always bothered me. I always have given to the poor and needy. I have even tithed hundreds of dollars at one time. But it always bothered me how the Pastors and Christians today seem to put such an emphasis on money and tithing. I read in Deuteronomy and other scriptures, and I always told my husband that I didn't feel in my spirit that tithe was money, or that it was even to soley go to the church. We used to go to a church where, when it was time to tithe, the Pastor would say, ecerytime: "God gives seed to the sower, if you don't have no seed, then you're not a sower!" Then he would tell everyone who did not have money to tithe, to stand up and tell everyone to give them a few dollars to tithe. It was humiliating. Then this last church that we went to, the pastor said that we were robbing God, that he would tithe his money to God even if we don't have pampers for his child. He said that what is God's belongs to Him, and he doesn't mess with what belongs to God. He's sincere about it. The sad part is that a lot of churches are so commercialized now a days. It's all aout the money. But then when we call churches for help, they say we have to be a member to receive hel help from them. It made me almost resentful to tithing. Although I'm not; I give we I can. But then I would question why we are struggling so badlyl is it because I'm not tithing? Thank you all for he responses. I just pray that we arè right. I wouln't want to miss heaven for the world!...or for not tithing. God bless you all!

Heidi & k. You're very welcome!

K.

I do believe in giving to the church free will offerings, then you are giving with a joyful heart, instead of a resentful one. Giving to the poor, food, clothing, helping someone in need, etc.etc.

If you feel you can give a tenth or more of your earnings then do so, if you feel you can not, then give what you can. It's not the amount, it's giving with a cheerful heart, and not being forced to do something.

I believe there are some preachers that have mislead their congregation as far as tithing is concerned for their own selfish benefits. What are they doing with the tithes; are they using it to buy expensive houses, cars,jewelry, clothing, and taking elaborate vacations with the money? Are they living a lavish lifestyle while the poor get poorer and don't have enough money to pay their rent or buy food? If they are then they are ones robbing God.

If they are using the funds appropriately for church upkeep, helping the needy and poor in their communities, etc., then they are using the money for God's work. Remember in scripture Jesus said when I was hunger you feed me, when I was naked, you clothed me, etc. and the reply was; Lord when did we feed you, cloth you, etc. Jesus said when you did it to the least of these, you did it unto me.

Don't feel guilty, give what you can when you can. God knows your heart, and knows you love Him.

I too use to feel badly, because I wasn't able to tithe with two small children, and my husband was working and didn't make much at the time. I gave what a could from the little I had, and I felt at peace, knowing that God was aware of my situation.

No you are not experiencing bad things happening to you and your husband because you are not tithing. They are happening to make you both stronger people. Remember bad things do happen to godly people, whether they tithe or not. Read Job, he was a good man, and look all he went through. It made him stronger and closer to God. He lost so much, but in the end God blessed him abundantly. He was being tested, to see if He would continue to be faithful to God and continue to love the Lord, no matter how bad things got. He past the test with flying colors. God's children are also tested in their lives, I know I have been tested, and I came through it all. Today, I feel very blessed and I'm able to say, I'm so much stronger and that much closer to God!

Keep your eyes on God, trust Him, totally and completely to see you through this period in your life, and in the end you will be victorious!

Blessings in Christ,

Valerie

K,
I came from a church like you did - sowing/reaping/increase/abundance, etc..... Singled out if you didn't give.... 2 offerings a message... (at least, and NEVER SKIPPED)

When I started about a year and a half ago studying the end times and found some of these dreams and experiences -I ALSO KINDA FREAKED OUT thinking I was disobeying God - I was SCARED TO DEATH that He would send me to hell.

I kept asking God over and over to reaveal His truth about tithing to me and I would do it. Because man had screwed up my thinking so much through THEIR teachings for THEIR gains....

I haven't gotten a direct answer about tithing yet - a year and a half later --- but Im trusting that He will lead me. I 'feel' (oooh - bad word) it's about being open handed with EVERYTHING you have.

:) Just know Im on this journey too :)

Thank you Valerie, Comeflyinthesky, and everyone else who replied. I have alwas been a free giver, and I will continue to be. Please keep my family in your prayers. We really need prayers right now. We're going through a lot right now, the enemy is attacking on every side and won't relent. I'm to the point now where every day I'm getting headahes, and I feel so overwhelmed, like I'm a zombie going through he motions. I feel like I'm in such a deep pit, and I can't see my way out. I know that Father is here, and He's working behind the scenes. When you can't see the end result, it makes it a little discouraging. Thanks. God is good...always.

Hi K.! Isn't Valerie just a blessing? And of course, many ppl on this board are!

Listen, in your deepest despair (and I've BEEN THERE!!) ~ not that long ago as a matter of fact... anyway, it IS Scriptural to go ahead AND THANK the Lord *ahead of time* for providing all your needs!! (even though YOU cannot SEE things being done in the heavenlies!) Phil 4:6 do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication **WITH THANKSGIVING** let your requests be made known to God.

When we were in such a pit ~ I honestly thought we were going to have to go live under a bridge... then I started doing some things:

Stopped *fussing* with DH ~ as we were in this together (money struggles seem to always bring on more dissension in a home!

So I decided I was going to stop throwing out threats of divorce... {hate to admit, I used to do that!} and told the Lord, I'd want to stay with my DH, to be in this TOGETHER -- even if it MEANT going to live in a shelter or under a bridge....

Also I did the Mark 11 ... with my faith as small as a mustard seed -- CAST THE MOUNTAIN (of debt, fear, unemployment, etc.) INTO THE SEA!! ~ and any time I'd even start to doubt (we're to NOT doubt in our hearts!) ~ I'd quickly tell myself NUH-UH!!! THAT mountain has been cast into the sea and will STAY there!!

K, thirdly, I made a promise to the Lord ~ that if we got a decent income, I'd make a point of paying off bills. Notice! I did not promise to *tithe* ~ as Valerie clearly points out... the tithe was to go to widows, orphans & the poor.

It was actually be coming OUT of bondage of feeling OBLIGATED to pay for those stained glass windows -- and making a commitment to the Lord to pay off bills -- plus the other things I just mentioned that helped us along!

We are now debt free except for the house, which I expect to be living in a HEAVENLY MANSION long before this house gets paid off!

At any rate, there is hope & there is help for you!

BTW, the church where we sometimes attend (aren't members.... we don't want the obligations of having to join in on everything ~ personal story) but anyway, the preacher goes off on cruises w/friends to Alaska -- IMO, no problem with that as long as HE personally is paying for it.

But then.... don't come back and *preach at me* that we need to give BIGGER tithes & offerings! (this happened once... and we walked out!)....

FTR, K, since we are presently not members, we prefer to give $ *DIRECTLY* to help widows, orphans, the poor!! (as churches would give a teeny-tiny fraction, and keep most for their building costs, new buildings, new parking lots, social events, etc. etc.) Hey I'm not down on churches (as it may sound like) ~ it's just that we're not fond of our $ going for that stuff.

We prefer to help where it's really TRULY needed!

Nowdays? Our little friend, (child thru' Compassion) in Mexico ~ actually prays FOR US!! Is that humbling or what? But it's b/c we've been able to be such a blessing to her & her family!

Her father had a severe stroke & the family is very poor, so we're able to help with grocery $ & she is just so, so thankful!

I highly recommend COMPASSION, BTW!!

So my advice? when the preacher tries to guilt trip people with the $$ sermons... it's time to walk out... and continue to seek the Lord to see where He'd like you to put your offerings. There are TONS of Scriptures on how we should help the poor.

I believe the Lord has better days in store for you, K.! Look to Him! Keep believing, trusting! And of course, remember to THANK Him!!

OK, I'd like to rehash this topic from early November. I found this from Jack Kelley, and now I may retract on what I had originally said regarding tithing. He makes a pretty good case for it. Please comment with your opinion if you could, because I don't even attend organized church, much less tithe, but I'd hate to be wrong about this and want to start if that is pleasing to the One who deserves it:

http://gracethrufaith.com/selah/spiritual-life/beyond-tithing-living-the-abundant-life/

Since God doesn't bless us financially for tithing, that's a moot question anyway. The promise given in the Book of Malachi is for the Jews in the Age of the Law, not the Church. It has no application to us. Anyway, it was agricultural products that the Jews were commanded to tithe, not money.

Trevor,

Kathy is right!

You should also read the above post I wrote in regards to tithe, especially the following:

" A surprising biblical fact is that the poor did not pay tithes, but, instead, received from the tithe. A separate chapter on the poor discusses this truth. This fact is made especially clear in the gleaning laws and in the purpose of the tithe. Jesus did not tithe, nor did he sin by failing to tithe because he was poor and did not own land or herd animals for his sustenance. The poor were only expected to give free-will offerings to the best of their ability.




From the list in this chapter it is easy to demonstrate that the contents of every recorded tithe found in the Mosaic Law is only from landowners and herdsmen of the land of Israel. This was a totally unexpected, yet very clear, truth about tithing that Bible study with an exhaustive concordance revealed. Also, strange as it may seem, Scriptural tithing was only intended for a society sustained almost wholly by agricultural crops and animal herds.



Biblical society included the following occupations: bakers, candle makers, carpenters, clothing makers, hired farm workers, hired herdsmen, hired household servants, jewelry craftsmen, masons, metal craftsmen, musicians, painters, perfume makers, physicians, sculptors, soldiers, tanners, teachers and tent makers. Yet NONE of these professions or products from these professions are included in any list of tithes or tithing! Why not? These sources provided much of the money for head taxes, temple taxes, tribute to foreign conquerors and, of course, free-will offerings. It is inconceivable to think that God simply forgot to include them in the many lists of items to be tithed."

Valerie

Well thank you for your thoughts on this,,, they are reassuring. have a great evening!

Bump.

This is an old thread, but I thought this would be a good time to bump it back up.

Christ fulfilled the law of Moses. The church is not under the law of Moses.

these are about tithing,

from gotquestions.org
Question: "What does the Bible say about Christian tithing? Should a Christian tithe?"
Answer: https://www.gotquestions.org/tithing-Christian.html

Question: "Does the teaching on tithing in Malachi 3:9-10 apply to us today?"
Answer: https://www.gotquestions.org/Malachi-tithing.html

Thanks for posting these links, Regina. I've been a Southern Baptist since the 7th grade, and the Baptists put great emphasis on tithes and offerings.

hi Kathy, thanks to Jesus forever that nothing can separate us from His love. there is the possibility of more or less rewards for a believer when we are before Jesus at the Bema seat, but the church will not be condemned or rewarded based upon the law of Moses. these are about the evaluation at the Bema seat:

https://www.gotquestions.org/judgment-seat-Christ.html

https://www.gotquestions.org/heavenly-crowns.html

Romans 8 (ESV)
31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? 33 Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.
34 Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword?
36 As it is written,

“For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.”
37 No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38 For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Bump.